GRRM Says Winds of Winter Not Going to Be Released Before S6 Premiers

edited January 2016 in Game of Thrones
New livejournal post: http://grrm.livejournal.com/465247.html

>Believe me, it gave me no pleasure to type those words. You're disappointed, and you're not alone. My editors and publishers are disappointed, HBO is disappointed, my agents and foreign publishers and translators are disappointed... but no one could possibly be more disappointed than me. For months now I have wanted nothing so much as to be able to say, "I have completed and delivered THE WINDS OF WINTER" on or before the last day of 2015.

But the book's not done.
ElisaBwgameofhome
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Comments

  • ... but no one could possibly be more disappointed than me. 
    I think this should be kept in mind. It probably won't, but it should. 
  • If I was him, I would have just released 10-15 chapters every 6 months and charge $10-15 per release. Better than waiting 6 years for an 80 chapter megabook. Everybody would have been happy with that. So I feel not for Mr. Martin.
  • I'm not even disappointed, because we all knew this was going to happen. If not with this book, then the next. Frankly, starting to shoot the series before all the books are published was always going to be a colossal fuckup. So I can't say I have any sympathy for GRRM or HBO. I do have all the sympathy in the world for the book readers though, especially for the ones that started way back in 1996 when the first one came out. Yes, the show is different, but the major plot points are the same, and even if you don't watch season 6, there is absolutely no way to avoid spoilers unless you turn off your internet and go live in a cave.
    Elisaryanfostertrippy
  • I do feel bad for him; he clearly wanted the Jon Snow resolution first released in the books rather than the show. And i couldn't even imagine the pressure he's under, which doesn't seem conducive to writing well.

    But as they say, the show must go on ... in this case quite literally. I'm at peace with it, and don't think it'll damper my enjoyment of the book when it eventually comes out.
    Elisa
  • kingbee67kingbee67 Los Angeles Ca.
    I don't know. I want a new book real bad, but the whole thing with him getting a new book out seems to be such a mess. I can see Matitin some years down the line gettin all bitter about the whole experience.
  • Agree it does feel messy, just crossing my fingers that any deviation between the two is not so big it effectively creates two separate stories. The detail in the books will hopefully see it through and allow it to continue to stand on its own
  • LukeLuke Central Illinois
    Oh it is already going the two separate story route imo. Either that or huge portions of Dance were superfluous red herrings. It will only get worse considering GRRM is a notorious rewritter and the DD's are working on a bare bones story outline he gave them before the final two books were written.

    The cynic in me says he really has no idea how to end it and has written himself into a corner.
    kingbee67steph_b
  • Durh, George.
  • ksa1001ksa1001 Plano, TX
    Who saw THIS coming? [need a sarcasam font]
    NikkiPHuntervoodoorat
  • I don't feel bad for him at all. He had more then enogh time, but he chose to do other things. Hell, it's been 20 years and he hasn't finished the story, or even started the last book. He knew he was on a clock once the series started, and he didn't try any harder to focus on writing. I hope we get the book in 2016, but I'm not even sure about that
    Dee
  • DeeDee Adelaide
    I agree with @Andrew Stadler - he can cry into his millions about it. Though as a non-book reader I am looking forward to not being spoiled for once by book readers who can't resist the urge to let everyone know they're a book reader.
    JaimieTNikkiPCory
  • JaimieTJaimieT Atlanta, GA
    ^^ Hey, why can't I like, funny and insightful that?
    Andrew StadlerDee
  • Also agree with Andrew - GRRM constantly brags about how busy it is and how many books he's writing/editing, he's developing several new tv shows and goes to events and conventions all the time. He could have finished TWOW a long, long time ago if he wanted to.

    I find it ironic that a couple years back he said he's afraid of messing up the ending and "pulling a Lost", and now, he's nowhere near the ending and he's already pulled a Lost in the meaning that he's getting as much, or possibly more hate than Lindelof ever did.
  • @Dee, the best thing about this news is how much less frequently people will get to say "in the books..." for the time being. Book snobs who revel in spoiling the show will be rending their garments this season and I'll be smirking through every moment of it.
    DeeCoryHuntertrippy
  • A_Ron_HubbardA_Ron_Hubbard Cincinnati, OH
    I don't have strong feelings one way or another, as I've been around long enough to see adaptations be faithful and even arguably better than their books counterparts, and vice versa.  I'm kind of nervous that the DDs seem to do their best work when the source material is stronger, but we'll see.

    Having said that, I got the Dunk and Egg compendium for Christmas, and am really enjoying this story.  I'm enjoying them a hell of a lot more than I did the first time through Feast and Dragon, that's for sure.  

    It's so weird seeing the two sides of the fan bases square up, and do battle over George's honor or lack there of.  While it's true that George seems to be a procrastinator and is probably battling depression over the weight of all this and could maybe stand to talk to a career counselor if not in general a therapist, and he has my sympathy, he also has an implicit contract with his fans to finish the damn books.  From what I've seen, he ain't writing any faster, and I could see him never finishing the saga, not from a health standpoint, but from a writing speed and motivation stand point.  I imagine the DDs hot on his tail provided a fairly sizable motivation to get up and type, and yet here we are.  I also imagine that failing to meet the modest goals he set for himself in 2015 and the show over taking him definitively might take what little wind he has in his sails.


    Andrew StadlerNikkiPBwgameofhomez74alweeniegirl
  • edited January 2016
    NikkiP said:

    @Dee, the best thing about this news is how much less frequently people will get to say "in the books..." for the time being. Book snobs who revel in spoiling the show will be rending their garments this season and I'll be smirking through every moment of it

    I had three custom garments made just for rending. I am ready.
    DeeNikkiP
  • You can't force good art, it just has to happen.  He should take his time, he is a fantastic writer.  
    HollyoakElisaCory
  • I've watched GoT as a completely spoiled non-book reader. I'm not sure how I feel about the show surpassing the books, because I don't know what kind of outline GRRM has shared with the show-runners. But I do know one thing I'll miss is A-Ron's spoiler editions of the podcast!
    Elisaschadenfreudianslip
  • I have to take issue with a few here who have said that GRRM has had plenty of time: "He had more then enough time, but he chose to do other things."

    I think that the majority of people out there, those that are not in the creative fields, really have no idea what it takes to write novels. It's not like a career where you sell shoes or make widgets. It can be a painful process, enhanced by many things: your personal mood, overworking, meetings, writer's block, etc.

    Sure, it's easy to say, "Well, he has a contract and he should have known. If he stopped doing all his other stuff like Wild Cards and editing anthologies, he would have finished it by now."

    Well, that's just not true. Writers and artists sometimes need to get away from their major work-in-progress to think clearly. They need time to let things settle and read it fresh again after several months. When you think of a series as big and sprawling as GoT, it gets incredibly complicated.

    I recently got a two-book deal with Houghton Mifflin Harcourt. I write literary fiction for young readers. My two books, the second of which isn't out until next year, required so much work between myself and my editor, publisher, marketing, etc, that I can't even imagine what it must be like to be in GRRM's shoes. On the one hand, it's a dream come true for him, to be so successful, on the other, I bet he often wishes the show had never happened, and he could've kept "his baby" all to himself.

    I feel for him.

    DummyDaveyMac
  • While I don't doubt that he's geniune, he's really not being honest with himself. It probably took a full month of 2015 to describe in excruciating detail the foods served at a feast and another month to give the family history of the third cousin of a nonessential character. I trust the Double Ds to do great work with the abridged version, but I wonder what they were provided.

    It would be unfortunate if both formats had to wrap up in a lackluster way because the books aren't finished -- if he's withdrawing from the show to finish the books but his failure to deliver on either messes up the last bit of both.

    I would say he's written himself into a corner, but he's done the opposite of that, and the root cause is what (IMO) separates the books from great works of literature in the first place. I don't fault him, I just think this is all because of a major weakness in his writing and hope the outcome is improvement.
    duncanpowers
  • ElisaElisa Los Angeles
    He chose to sell his books/series to HBO and the Double D's before it was completed.  It is what it is and people might remember the TV show more than the books in the end.
  • A_Ron_HubbardA_Ron_Hubbard Cincinnati, OH
    Zinzan said:

    I've watched GoT as a completely spoiled non-book reader. I'm not sure how I feel about the show surpassing the books, because I don't know what kind of outline GRRM has shared with the show-runners. But I do know one thing I'll miss is A-Ron's spoiler editions of the podcast!

    Perhaps the spoiler sections won't go away, they'll just morph into something else, like trying to figure out where the show is going or if events depicted on screen debunk or support popular fan theories?  I dunno, but I'd hate for the spoiler show to go away entirely.
    duncanpowersDummyElisaAndrew StadlerBwgameofhomeweeniegirl
  • LukeLuke Central Illinois
    Watching what fan theories get completely debunked by the show is what I'm looking forward to most. There will be some epic Internet nerd rants going down because some of the more popular theories have been around for literally decades.
    ElisaNikkiPHunter
  • I actually think GRRM is in a unique situation that he can benefit from. How many people actually get a chance to "test" an ending and if it sucks re-write it?

    The TV show will certainly finish before he is anywhere near done with the final book. He has said he has the ending and it has been delivered to the Ds. However, once the ending airs he can actually gauge the response to it. If it really sucks he can simply re-write the ending for the book to something else. No harm no foul. 

    If it was me I would use this to my advantage. 
    A_Ron_Hubbardakritenbrink
  • Hatorian said:

    I actually think GRRM is in a unique situation that he can benefit from. How many people actually get a chance to "test" an ending and if it sucks re-write it?


    The TV show will certainly finish before he is anywhere near done with the final book. He has said he has the ending and it has been delivered to the Ds. However, once the ending airs he can actually gauge the response to it. If it really sucks he can simply re-write the ending for the book to something else. No harm no foul. 
    Yeah, I strongly disagree with this.
    HatorianAndrew Stadler
  • A_Ron_HubbardA_Ron_Hubbard Cincinnati, OH
    It would be entertaining, to see a he-said-they-said between DD's and GRRM about whether they botched his ideas or he changed them.  Pizzolotto vs Fukunaga would be tame by comparison, I'm sure.
  • HeffHeff Connecticut
    If I was a writer, that would be what I would put the vast majority of my time into - and I would NOT be working on a different project after having signed a multi-million-dollar HBO contract for my unfinished series...

    It's been 5 or 6 years since Dance came out, and I honestly find it hard to believe that would be the case if he was working at it as hard as he says he has been. His reaction, to me, resembles how I feel when I first realize I forgot to pay one of my bills; 'Oh, shit, I was supposed to DO that...."
  • I have watched the whole show and am finally reading the books (halfway through book 3 right now). I'm mildly annoyed that the tv content is moving past the books. But I'm really feeling more interested than anything else, at how the stories diverge. If I were Martin and my contract with HBO permitted, I would definitely consider "having second thoughts" and changing the last book or two to take the ending in a very different direction, just for the excitement factor.
  • If I was him I'd give all the details to HBO and make the next two books descriptions food and people slowly eating it and telling each other how good it is. Everyone gets along and tells stories, one of which is Jon's mother really was just some farm girl Ned met on the road. Bang that out in a couple weeks, update livejournal with some stuff about cats, go hang out at his movie theater and live life a free man. 
    CaptainTripsryanfoster
  •   It will be an interesting year.  I for one will keep a close eye on the show vs. the official posted spoiler chapters and the chapters that were hacked and uploaded.

      Will the show catch up to the spoiler chapters?   Will the show be the same as the hacked/stolen chapters..  we will all find out in April.  Will the show be finished prior to the release of the last book( I might be encouraged to make a wager it would). 

     


    ryanfosterElisa
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