Suicide Squad (potential spoilers)

Hatorian

Just got out of the movie. It was ok. Nothing special. The hype was too much and almost all of the best parts are in the trailers. It really doesn't do anything new for the superhero/villain genre. Plus it's not very funny. Also if you're going to see this because of the Joker be prepared to be disappointed. When he's there he's good. But he's in it maybe 5 minutes.

Ps I'm not a marvel or dc fan boy. I like both.

WonderedObject

Damn shame. I really wanted it to be good. Like really good.
I'll still watch it but these reviews forced me to switch from a Thursday night XD showing to a Friday matinee.

Raiyne

I had a feeling it was going to be that way.
I watched the available trailers on You Tube last weekend and said to myself I bet all the good parts are in the trailer.
Also the one liners are not very funny or original.
I will say Margot Robbie looks "bomb af"
If I was 20 years younger, I know who I'd be going as for Halloween this year (along with about 20 million other girls)
and the pre-released soundtrack songs are catchy as hell!

Hatorian

I really wanted it to be good too. The soundtrack is awesome for sure. Unfortunately a lot of the reviews are accurate. The biggest issues I read about are true.

1. The overall editing of the film makes it really clunky in certain spots
2. The story and main villain(s) is just plain and boring.
3. Little Joker

I know it's Suicide Squad and not the Joker movie but I really think this movie could have went from Ok to great with 10 more minutes of Bad ass Joker shit. I know Nolan did great with a pg13 rating but it would have been cool to get this as an R rated movie and truly get some disturbing scenes. Instead it was pretty lame and standard cut away.

EDIT: I don't want to shit on the movie. It was ok, fine and decent. I don't want my money back. My Wife really liked it but agreed she was disappointed hardly any Joker.

Some things I liked

1. Margot Robbie is awesome and hot af
2. Jared Leto is great but so underused. He definitely has his own take on the Joker
3. They did a good job of introducing the characters without the need for drawn out origins. They were quick and to the point and got me up to speed with the characters

WonderedObject

I know what you mean. Seems like it's suffering from the same problems that BVS and MOS had. The pieces look to be there but they can't seem to put it all together. As a result, the movies come out as extremely clunky.
Cavil- good superman in my opinion
Affleck- great batman
Gadot- surprisingly really good WW
Eisenberg- terrible Luthor
The cast works. But the movies just don't deliver. Not in the way they should. Suicide Squad looks to be the same. Great cast but just can't deliver on its full potential.
This is frustrating. What's next, Wonder Woman? That looks great but damn, the past movies had great trailers as well.
Any ideas as to how they can fix this? I always thought Synder was the issue but this was done by David Ayer. I enjoyed his work on End of Watch and Training day. I really want DC to find their footing. Such great characters in that universe.

MrX

I really wanted it to be good too. The soundtrack is awesome for sure. Unfortunately a lot of the reviews are accurate. The biggest issues I read about are true.

1. The overall editing of the film makes it really clunky in certain spots

Sounds like they overreacted to BvS criticism and ruined it with re-shoots and re-edits:

http://io9.gizmodo.com/report-warner-bros-turned-suicide-squad-into-a-mess-i-1784760580

Murderbear

The Joker is only in it for five minutes?? After all the crap we heard about him torturing his costars and acting like a crazy person? All for fiveish minutes of screen time? Ugh.

Melia004

Warner Bros. refuses to allow a creative process, due to audiences having reacted badly to the prior movie, rinse, repeat... I now actively want this branch of DC movies to die and fall off of the tree. I still do not comprehend how people actually LIKED Batfleck, and now they're giving the guy more control. Justice League is gonna suck. That sucks...

davemcb

The Joker is in the movie for a max of 25 minutes, I also think Leto's performance is average but he wasn't really allowed off the leash if he got more time it could have been different. 

I agree with most of the comments on here, its not a bad movie but it is in no way a game changer and the hype didn't help. The reaction to BvS must have impacted the re-shoots/re-editing of the film as well as the test screeners

There were a number of clunky performances I thought Flag was horrible, but I liked most of the main cast performances outside of the cheesy Will Smith lines. 

Margot Robbie was really good whilst destroying the Vicky Mendoza Diagonal, she looked amazing but it actually takes away from certain moments (but i'm not complaining). There were some girls dressed as Harley Quinn watching this movie and I can imagine Halloween is going to very interesting this year.

The movie wasn't helped by not having a well known adversary for the team to go against, only hard core comic readers would know of her.

The sound track was incredible and had me tapping my feet the whole time

Hatorian

Damn Revenant reshoot a! If it wasn't for that we would have got Tom Hardy as flag. Plus I would disagree with 25 minutes of Joker. I would put money the actual screen time is closer to 5 than 25.

EDIT: quick Google search shows someone counting 7 minutes of screen time. But that's just a random Google hit

BigSmell

When Diablo referred to the other villains as his family, I wanted to punch myself in the face about a hundred times. Also I am totally over seeing a giant ray of light shoot up into the sky.

Hatorian

Yea. Totally unearned there after being together for like 4 hours

Hatorian

Here's how I would have fixed Suicide Squad. (not that anyone cares)

1. 5 minute free Webisodes of each character that releases each week up to the release of the movie. Not only does this build hype for the movie itself but helps create more backstory. Can make money off the ads that play before the webisodes. I am sure they could make these relatively cheap. How much would it cost to have Harley interview Joker for 5 minutes? no CGI, no crazy action. Just insane dialogue. It would also break some ground in new ways to market a movie and experience.

2. More Joker. Have him be a constant threat of trying to find/get Harley. (they half-assed this in the movie but I think they could have done it much better, I mean some of the  best parts of the movie were him trying to save Harley, expand on that)

3. Do anything but have a stock villian with a magical hole in the sky and a countdown to end of the world. Not every CBM needs to be save the world theme. The stakes did not have to be that high. Maybe have them protect the Enchantress' heart and instead of the team going to the Echantress maybe they are running from her or trying to get it to a specific location where they can't just fly into. Im no writer so I am sure someone could come up with something better than whats been done a million times. 

4. Make it rated R. I will be surprised if this movie beats Deadpool's box office. But it could have if the villains were given proper scenes to make them bad. There is nothing to talk about this movie near the water cooler. besides it was not as good as hyped. Imagine the water cooler after seeing Joker torture some dude in some crazy way or Deadshot blow 5 people's brains out with 1 shot. The best PR is free PR and that is accomplished by making people talk. I went into work today and didn't even tell anyone I saw the movie. Cuz there was no reason to. 

Aron and Jim also talked about CBM genre and fatigue. I am honestly worried that this may not be permanent. And number 3 is the reason why. How many times can you have the world is gonna end if the heroes dont save the day. How many holes in the sky can people take before they are just tired of it. Avengers, Avengers 2, TMNT, SS, they all do the same thing. its already lame now. 

amyja89

I thought it was a hot damn mess. Some enjoyable performances but the editing made it seem as though most of the characters were starring in their own solo movies rather than a fluid ensemble piece. The majority of the dialogue was absolutely cringe worthy, especially the Diablo "you're my family" part.

Viola Davis is a great actress, and I enjoyed her performance in a kind of meta way, she looked and acted about as over it and pissed off with all of the squad's bullshit as I was! And the whole central Witch brother and sister villain plot fell completely flat for me, no innovation or intrigue at all.

Doctor_Nick

Ok, I'm not seeing this, and I haven't seen Batman/Superman but I'd like to respond to a few things about the competing studios/companies in the podcast.

The massive lead that DC had in movies over Marvel.  I, for one, always thought Marvel was massively underachieving in film, I expected Marvel to do better than DC in film because they'd been a better comics company for decades.  I remember when I collected comics in the 1990s, making sense of the DC Universe was tough.  Granted, it helped that Marvel published Marvel Saga when I was getting into comics, but DC really could have benefited from a book like that. I guess now it doesn't really make a difference as you could read about it all on the internet, but I really got the sense that the DC Universe didn't actually fit together very well if you read outside of single character comics.

Batman is DC's one unalloyed great mainstream character.  Superman is a great property, but writing for him is tough. There's also a certain cheesy factor to mainstream DC (Invisible plane, lasso of truth, ring that makes giant objects that do things, Young Teen Titans) that I don't get from Marvel. Plus Marvel has the well worn tropes of humanizing their characters and writing much more appealing backstories (again, excepting Batman here).  

Oh, and on the Magnificent Seven trailer discussion:

IMO 

Seven Samurai is easily > The sixties Magnificent Seven, which is kinda not what it sounded like at least one of you thought (?Jim)

A_Ron_Hubbard

I agree with you. SS is better than TMS, but the latter is much, much more accessible.

Nathan

I went through a goddamn cycle of emotions after watching this film. First was confusion, then anger, then intense sadness lamenting what could have been. Then I started creating better plots in my head, which made me feel a little better.

But back to what we got - the plot was bad, the villain was bad, the characters were bad. The whole point of the Suicide Squad is to use villains as expendable soldiers, but when the villain is FUCKING MAGIC, and you've got Gunman, a girl with a baseball bat, and FUCKING CAPTAIN BOOMERANG on your elite squad, it actively made no sense. The villain should have been Joker or a more managable threat, because it's actually defeatable by the team. Enchantress should have won hands down - especially when their only metahuman threat was taken down.

Another thing to point out is how badly characters like Croc, Katana, Slipknot and to an extent Boomerang were treated. Their roles could easily have been condensed down to one - although in this case, I would have just prefered to let Katana actually have more plot. This is (besides the terrible use of Jubilee in X Men) the FIRST REAL ASIAN SUPERHERO. Yet Katana is only there to be a plot device. Boomerang was useless (although him leaving in the bar was great, but immediately undermined by his sudden return). I literally could not understand Croc, and it's sad to see another minority character Slipknot, be the one to bite the bullet.

Would love to have a go redoing this movie. 

Also, SO MUCH STUFF FROM THE TRAILERS WAS NOT THERE!!! Isn't that false advertising??

Melia004

Nathan said:

I went through a goddamn cycle of emotions after watching this film. First was confusion, then anger, then intense sadness lamenting what could have been. Then I started creating better plots in my head, which made me feel a little better.

But back to what we got - the plot was bad, the villain was bad, the characters were bad. The whole point of the Suicide Squad is to use villains as expendable soldiers, but when the villain is FUCKING MAGIC, and you've got Gunman, a girl with a baseball bat, and FUCKING CAPTAIN BOOMERANG on your elite squad, it actively made no sense. The villain should have been Joker or a more managable threat, because it's actually defeatable by the team. Enchantress should have won hands down - especially when their only metahuman threat was taken down.

Another thing to point out is how badly characters like Croc, Katana, Slipknot and to an extent Boomerang were treated. Their roles could easily have been condensed down to one - although in this case, I would have just prefered to let Katana actually have more plot. This is (besides the terrible use of Jubilee in X Men) the FIRST REAL ASIAN SUPERHERO. Yet Katana is only there to be a plot device. Boomerang was useless (although him leaving in the bar was great, but immediately undermined by his sudden return). I literally could not understand Croc, and it's sad to see another minority character Slipknot, be the one to bite the bullet.

Would love to have a go redoing this movie. 

Also, SO MUCH STUFF FROM THE TRAILERS
WAS NOT THERE!!! Isn't that false
advertising??

So, by "first real Asian", I assume that doesn't include Russians? I had thought they were Asian

adobo1148

30 mins in, I wanted to leave, and I'm sure wasn't the only one. The energy in that theater was virtually nonexistent.

TheEconomist

A_Ron_Hubbard said:

I agree with you. SS is better than TMS, but the latter is much, much more accessible.

You get a much better appreciation of Kurosawa after you realize that George Lucas admits he's the main inspiration for the story structure and film making techniques of Star Wars. If Kurosawa made English language films with a Hollywood budget I can only imagine what they'd be like.

Frakkin T

I hear what you guys are saying, and I won't try to refute your points, but I really enjoyed this movie. I think we can take it as a given that superhero movies are going to have mostly weak villians and paint-by-numbers plots, but it's all in the execution. Deadpool was a similar combination of a standard comic book plot and a big sense of humor, but I thought most of the jokes were dumb and I didn't love the character so I came away not very impressed with it. SS, on the other hand, was a lot of fun. I loved the crazy chaos of Harley and Deadshot came off just as likable and charismatic as any other Will Smith role. And the music they chose was amazing and fit so well into the universe. I would even say that SS uses its soundtrack better than Guardians of the Galaxy used its. 

I think people are used to shitting on DC movies, and superhero fatigue is a real thing, but this movie fits into the BvS universe but also transcends it by remembering why we go to the movies: Not so we can go home and talk about it on the internet but so we can have some damn fun.

PS I don't want to sound like one of those butthurt DC fans that want to shut down rotten tomatoes; to be clear this is the first DCEU movie that I thought was any good. 

WintersComingAfterFall

I seen it twice now and really enjoyed it. Was a fun movie and the characters were the strong part outweighing the plot which was a bit messy. Mt theatre was into it both times with laughs throughout it the whole movie. The reviews are way harsh and its becoming a trend wit critics n DC movies. Even the bad marvel movies which there are plenty of, get atleast 50/50 reviews. I dont expect oscar worthy movies wit these and i tend to enjoy them that way.

Nathan

Melia004 said:

Nathan said:

So, by "first real Asian", I assume that doesn't include Russians? I had thought they were Asian

Goddamn, the way you quoted me by just saying "first real Asian" makes me sound like a right racist.

But you're comment made me laugh. So good for you

The film did a lot in terms of the diversity of the cast, but fell flat in terms of having most characters be one note and have little to say/do besides Harley, Flagg, Will Smith and Waller.

Freddy

I like how The Joker was modeled after an early 90s street pimp.

Degausser24

I enjoyed large chunks of it, just not sure the movie holds together. Will smith and Margoe Robbie were phenomenal, and I might be in the minority but I actually dug leto's performance. I actually felt like the thing that soured me on the movie was the dialog. There were just SO. MANY. ONE. LINERS. I know Ayer is a better writer than that (motherfucker wrote training day) so I have to assume it was noted to death.

Melia004

Degausser24 said:

I enjoyed large chunks of it, just not sure the movie holds together. Will smith and Margoe Robbie were phenomenal, and I might be in the minority but I actually dug leto's performance. I actually felt like the thing that soured me on the movie was the dialog. There were just SO. MANY. ONE. LINERS. I know Ayer is a better writer than that (motherfucker wrote training day) so I have to assume it was noted to death.

Absolutely, it was. Warner Bros. keeps destroying its own products in trying to save them. No one liked MoS, so they overreacted with BvS, which no one liked and which caused an overreaction in making SS... DC Studios will never get to where Marvel has without building from the base, and they wanna jump right to mega-smash team up flicks.

Hatorian

I actually liked MOS. I put it above Avengers 2, Thors, etc. Its not the worst superhero movie we got recently. 

BvS could have worked. Batfleck worked fine. Cavill is a decent Superman. They just ran into a few issues. One of themn was Lex Luthor being a poor man's pyscho Joker instead of a calculated cold-hearted super genius bad ass. 

I honestly think this goes on Snyder. I think he is just in over his head with a universe building epic franchise. He can make some really cool scenes but thats it. His stories are just missing several ingredients. He seems to care more about individual "money shots" than he does for the story and that has led to BvS looking pretty damn gorgeous but falling flat. 

Warner Bros is not helping themselves by meddling.  

Degausser24

Hatorian said:

I actually liked MOS. I put it above Avengers 2, Thors, etc. Its not the worst superhero movie we got recently. 

BvS could have worked. Batfleck worked fine. Cavill is a decent Superman. They just ran into a few issues. One of themn was Lex Luthor being a poor man's pyscho Joker instead of a calculated cold-hearted super genius bad ass. 

I honestly think this goes on Snyder. I think he is just in over his head with a universe building epic franchise. He can make some really cool scenes but thats it. His stories are just missing several ingredients. He seems to care more about individual "money shots" than he does for the story and that has led to BvS looking pretty damn gorgeous but falling flat. 

Warner Bros is not helping themselves by meddling.  

Yeah it absolutely is Snyder. I'd go as far to say that from what little I've seen Affleck is the best batman I've seen. Dude gets the character. He was a comic fan since the 80's, so I think he understands the dichotomy better than batmans that came before. The problem with MoS and bvs is they just have no heart. They're uninspiring. Superman is supposed to be a hero, a symbol for hope, not a mopey asshole. Snyder lets his Ayn Randian personal beliefs infect the way superman is handled. When Martha Kent says to them "be there hero, or don't, you don't owe this world anything" that's ridiculous! Superman would never agree with that statement. The whole point of superman In the comics is that he loves humans. He's grown up as one his whole life. He's always more of the noble simple farm boy in the comics, not a brooding alien who's weary of all humans.

Melia004

Degausser24 said:

Hatorian said:

I actually liked MOS. I put it above Avengers 2, Thors, etc. Its not the worst superhero movie we got recently. 

BvS could have worked. Batfleck worked fine. Cavill is a decent Superman. They just ran into a few issues. One of themn was Lex Luthor being a poor man's pyscho Joker instead of a calculated cold-hearted super genius bad ass. 

I honestly think this goes on Snyder. I think he is just in over his head with a universe building epic franchise. He can make some really cool scenes but thats it. His stories are just missing several ingredients. He seems to care more about individual "money shots" than he does for the story and that has led to BvS looking pretty damn gorgeous but falling flat. 

Warner Bros is not helping themselves by meddling.  

Yeah it absolutely is Snyder. I'd go as far to say that from what little I've seen Affleck is the best batman I've seen. Dude gets the character. He was a comic fan since the 80's, so I think he understands the dichotomy better than batmans that came before. The problem with MoS and bvs is they just have no heart. They're uninspiring. Superman is supposed to be a hero, a symbol for hope, not a mopey asshole. Snyder lets his Ayn Randian personal beliefs infect the way superman is handled. When Martha Kent says to them "be there hero, or don't, you don't owe this world anything" that's ridiculous! Superman would never agree with that statement. The whole point of superman In the comics is that he loves humans. He's grown up as one his whole life. He's always more of the noble simple farm boy in the comics, not a brooding alien who's
weary of all humans.

Please explain HOW Affleck is the best Batman. I cannot understand how this guy did NOTHING but to act like the asshole he is in real life as Bruce Wayne, and did nothing but bring an Arkham Batman game to life. I swear, I am not trying to say your opinion is invalid, I just cannot grasp what is resonating so much with people. What did Ben Affleck do to make that Batman even ok? He was Ben Affleck in a costume. He's still basically Shannon the mall worker from Mallrats, in every role...

Jovial_Falcon

@Melia004 i have not seen SS or BVS but both Bruce Wayne and Batman act like assholes as far as I'm concerned if he played it like that then its spot on for me.

Degausser24

Melia004 said:

Degausser24 said:

Hatorian said:

I actually liked MOS. I put it above Avengers 2, Thors, etc. Its not the worst superhero movie we got recently. 

BvS could have worked. Batfleck worked fine. Cavill is a decent Superman. They just ran into a few issues. One of themn was Lex Luthor being a poor man's pyscho Joker instead of a calculated cold-hearted super genius bad ass. 

I honestly think this goes on Snyder. I think he is just in over his head with a universe building epic franchise. He can make some really cool scenes but thats it. His stories are just missing several ingredients. He seems to care more about individual "money shots" than he does for the story and that has led to BvS looking pretty damn gorgeous but falling flat. 

Warner Bros is not helping themselves by meddling.  

Yeah it absolutely is Snyder. I'd go as far to say that from what little I've seen Affleck is the best batman I've seen. Dude gets the character. He was a comic fan since the 80's, so I think he understands the dichotomy better than batmans that came before. The problem with MoS and bvs is they just have no heart. They're uninspiring. Superman is supposed to be a hero, a symbol for hope, not a mopey asshole. Snyder lets his Ayn Randian personal beliefs infect the way superman is handled. When Martha Kent says to them "be there hero, or don't, you don't owe this world anything" that's ridiculous! Superman would never agree with that statement. The whole point of superman In the comics is that he loves humans. He's grown up as one his whole life. He's always more of the noble simple farm boy in the comics, not a brooding alien who's
weary of all humans.

Please explain HOW Affleck is the best Batman. I cannot understand how this guy did NOTHING but to act like the asshole he is in real life as Bruce Wayne, and did nothing but bring an Arkham Batman game to life. I swear, I am not trying to say your opinion is invalid, I just cannot grasp what is resonating so much with people. What did Ben Affleck do to make that Batman even ok? He was Ben Affleck in a costume. He's still basically Shannon the mall worker from Mallrats, in every role...

I mean for me at least, he physically embodied batman as well as anyone. As far as his Bruce, Kevin conroy who voiced Bruce/Batman on the animated series used to always say that he affected his voice when he was Bruce to make it more light and airy. The batman voice was his normal voice. I kinda agree with that. Bruce should be a more fake jovial billionaire douche. I just kinda got the right vibe from Affleck. And this is coming from someone who overall hated bvs. It just really makes me look forward to a solo Affleck movie. Also, he's writing and directing it, which could be great. Imagine the town but with batman. As much as I love the Nolan batman movies, I never felt like bale quite nailed the character. Dude is a great actor and did a good job finding the pathos, but I just never really felt his Bruce or his batman 100%