Sharp Objects Ep. 2 - "Dirt" - No Book Spoilers!

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Comments

  • I see there is speculation about who Amma's mother is. Camille is probably 40 or so years old.  How old is Amma?  15?  So Camille's mother has Camille at 18, that means she had Amma when she was 43 and is 58 now.  That is pushing it....

    Also, I know it's a Hollywood production, and people have talked about someone drinking as much as Camille does not looking as good as she does, but most everyone in this two-bit town seems too conventionally attractive.  They could have done with some more character...
  • cdrivecdrive Houston, TX
    edited July 2018
    It's the mom and the stepdad, working together right? It has to be.  They're so fucking weird.  He's the guy strong enough to pull teeth.  She's the lady in white.  


    Shout out to Sophia Lillis of IT and Lulu Wilson of Ouija and Annabelle Creation!
    Doctor_NickJaimieT
  • JaimieTJaimieT Atlanta, GA
    cdrive said:
    It's the mom and the stepdad, working together right? It has to be.  They're so fucking weird.  He's the guy strong enough to pull teeth.  She's the lady in white.  


    Shout out to Sophia Lillis of IT and Lulu Wilson of Ouija and Annabelle Creation!

    If so, this is a nice wrap-up if Amma is Camille's daughter.
  • Garthgou81Garthgou81 Placerville, CA
    The lady in white that steps out of brush was one of more unsettling things I've seen on a TV show in a while. Its one of those things that Lynch does so well. Where its not a jump scare or anything really that should be inherently scary. But how out of place the imagery is just throws you off your game entirely. 
  • MichelleMichelle California
    I don't buy that Amma is Camille's daughter.  You'd think that she would know if Amma were her daughter or not, and there is no recognition at all of anything other than a distanced half-sister relationship.
  • JeffreyJeffrey Des Moines
    One thing that's distracting for me about this show is it doesn't show newspaper reporting correctly.

    The story they show on Camille's laptop has a spot news lede -- a breaking news. This is the sort of story that would have been filed by someone in the newsroom before she even left St. Louis. And this comes after 1.5 episodes of Camille and her editor discussing the kind of story that would be a huge Sunday 1A takeout that runs 5,000 words or more.

    Moreover, Camille drives around town with a "working press" sign on her dashboard that I don't remember anyone ever using in the 25 years I spent in journalism. Virtually every journalist would just wear a lanyard with a press pass attached.

  • All the ChickensAll the Chickens Birmingham, AL
    edited July 2018
    My wife and I just watched the first two episodes on Sunday night. The lady in white was horrifying, just thinking of her/it standing at the edge of the woods behind the trees.

    They want us to believe that half-sister ("Amma" I think?) is actually her daughter, right? Her mom could possibly have had a daughter 14 or 15  years ago, but it's unlikely without going through IVF or some fertility treatments. And after my wife and I both agreed she was Camille's daughter, the scene in the gas station had Amma's girlfriends jokingly pointing out that Camille is old enough to be their mother, to which her "half-sister" became a bit annoyed with them. It seemed a bit on the nose.

    And then that makes me think that the thing that Camille did that her mother was so embarrassed about was getting knocked up, even if maybe her being knocked up wasn't a consensual act?
  • Doctor_NickDoctor_Nick Terminus
    edited July 2018
    Camille could be acting.  Though you'd think in such a busy body town that people would know she had ben pregnant, unless she "went away" for treatment, supposedly for something else, at a residential facility at some point in her youth.

    Michelle said:
    I don't buy that Amma is Camille's daughter.  You'd think that she would know if Amma were her daughter or not, and there is no recognition at all of anything other than a distanced half-sister relationship.

    rkcrawf
  • All the ChickensAll the Chickens Birmingham, AL
    edited July 2018
    Also, what year is this set in? Today? I've grown up in and around smaller towns in the south. Most of these people (in real life) have social media addictions, highspeed internet, smart phones, air conditioning, many don't have noticeably strong accents, etc., just like anyone else who isn't being interviewed about a tornado or flood by the local news. There are also a much higher percent of black people in most of the small towns I've grown up in. Of course if this is a small town in the midwest, that changes the diversity scale back to "extremely white" compared to the south.

    Anyhow, I don't mind the stereotypes and I actually enjoy this throwback town where everyone is just sitting around drinking on their front porch and literally roller skating around town just to pass the time instead of playing on their tablets. It really sets up this Stephen King vibe in the town being a bit 'off'.

    I just wonder if this is meant to depict small town america in 2018, and if people from bigger cities who don't travel small town america much actually think this is what it's like? I'm leaning towards this being a purposeful Stephen King "Derry" vibe to crank up the creep factor.
  • cdrivecdrive Houston, TX
    Camille could be acting.  Though you'd think in such a busy body town that people would know she had ben pregnant, unless she "went away" for treatment, supposedly for something else, at a residential facility at some point in her youth.

    Michelle said:
    I don't buy that Amma is Camille's daughter.  You'd think that she would know if Amma were her daughter or not, and there is no recognition at all of anything other than a distanced half-sister relationship.

    Well I didn't remember it in the watch, but @JoshTheBlack said Camille wasn't able to leave the house for a year after her sister's death.  Maybe the Mom was shut in for a year also?  Y'all really got me going on this "Amma is Camille's daughter" theory with the "old enough to be our mother" comment.

    Is that why she is a cutter?  And cutting her stomach/womb area?  Did they have to keep sharp objects away from her if she was a very young teen forced to go through a pregnancy of a baby she didn't want because the conception/rape happened in that freak ass meat shed?  So she wouldn't harm herself or the fetus?  Her Mom seems super concerned about the family appearance so that would be the cover up?  The town is too hazed-out drunk to notice cause they're like the Lotus-Eaters in Odyssey?  I went off on a tangent there, sorry.  I'll just let this show take it's time and come to me.  




  • That Mom could definitely have spun a story about needing her confinement for a surprise pregnancy of her own.  

    cdrive said:
    Camille could be acting.  Though you'd think in such a busy body town that people would know she had ben pregnant, unless she "went away" for treatment, supposedly for something else, at a residential facility at some point in her youth.

    Michelle said:
    I don't buy that Amma is Camille's daughter.  You'd think that she would know if Amma were her daughter or not, and there is no recognition at all of anything other than a distanced half-sister relationship.

    Well I didn't remember it in the watch, but @JoshTheBlack said Camille wasn't able to leave the house for a year after her sister's death.  Maybe the Mom was shut in for a year also?  Y'all really got me going on this "Amma is Camille's daughter" theory with the "old enough to be our mother" comment.

    Is that why she is a cutter?  And cutting her stomach/womb area?  Did they have to keep sharp objects away from her if she was a very young teen forced to go through a pregnancy of a baby she didn't want because the conception/rape happened in that freak ass meat shed?  So she wouldn't harm herself or the fetus?  Her Mom seems super concerned about the family appearance so that would be the cover up?  The town is too hazed-out drunk to notice cause they're like the Lotus-Eaters in Odyssey?  I went off on a tangent there, sorry.  I'll just let this show take it's time and come to me.  





  • edited July 2018

    I've been enjoying the deep cut Zepplin tracks in the first couple episodes and it got me thinking about how this ties into the plot.  The Zepplin tracks are used very deliberately, e.g. Camille physically selects the song as she's driving around.  The music seems to take center stage during these scenes as opposed to being just background or mood setting music.

    I remembered that Led Zepplin and, most prominently lead guitarist Jimmy Page, were really into the occult.  In 1970, Page purchased a supposedly haunted English manor previously owned by famed magician and occultist Aleister Crowley.  Soon after, Page staged a magic ritual at the manor with two other members of the band, Robert Plant and John Bonham - the fourth member, John Paul Jones, refused to participate.  This ritual was designed to impart unimaginable power and something akin to everlasting life.  While Led Zepplin went on to become one of the largest and most successful rock bands in history, a series of strange mishaps began to occur, leading many to believe in a "Led Zepplin curse".  These mishaps included a number of negative tour events but also included near fatal car crashes, the death of Robert Plant's 3 year old son, and the death of John Bonham.  

    Jimmy Page also produced the music for a film project by noted Crowley disciple Kenneth Anger, called Lucifer Rising.  The original lead actor ended up being part of the Manson Cult and getting sentenced to life in prison for murder.  The music Page produced for Lucifer Rising was some of his creepiest and was used as the intro to the song In The Evening.  In The Evening is used in Sharp Objects episode 2.

    So, does this suggest the occult is alive and well in Wind Gap?  Is there a generations long curse running through the town?  Have the town's most successful families sold their souls in exchange for worldly delights?  I don't know but I'm becoming very interested to find out.

    JaimieT2manyboogersDoubleA_Ron
  • edited July 2018
    I like the Camille being Amma's mother theory but it seems more likely that Amma is adopted. With her daughters gone Adora needed a new doll for her doll house. In the beginning of last episode when Camille is in the office with her boss she tells him her mom & step-father had a kid, and immediately corrects it to "have" and casually says she doesn't know her.

    This doesn't preclude the Camille mother theory but it does seem to make everything... weird. I agree with @Michelle that it would just make the whole family dynamic even stranger, and I can't help but think Adora would take every possible opportunity to twist that knife whenever she could get away with it.

    My problem with the idea of Adora and Alan as suspects is the MO. Adora is utterly obsessed with image and reputation, so why would she trash her town's reputation with high profile murders, and with tooth-pulling madness and whatnot? If she's so obsessed with that image that she saw the girls as such blights on the town she wanted to kill them, why not do so discreetly like feeding them to her hogs or something? Then the victims are just troubled youth runaways, not high profile serial killer victims. 

    Edit: Also, if Camille is Amma's mother than she was ~24 when she was conceived. Not exactly super scandalous even if this took place decades ago, and I can't imagine Camille staying in Wind Gap a day longer than she'd need to, so she would've what, shown up one day and dropped off her kid to be raised as her half-sister? I can't imagine the whole town not knowing if something like that happened.  
  • All the ChickensAll the Chickens Birmingham, AL
    ghm3 said:. 

    Edit: Also, if Camille is Amma's mother than she was ~24 when she was conceived. Not exactly super scandalous even if this took place decades ago, and I can't imagine Camille staying in Wind Gap a day longer than she'd need to, so she would've what, shown up one day and dropped off her kid to be raised as her half-sister? I can't imagine the whole town not knowing if something like that happened.  
    Did they say how old Camille is? They probably did, but I missed it. I figured early to mid 30s. But the older you make Camille, the more that ages Adora, which makes it more unlikely that Amma is her biological daughter. (Yes I know it can happen, since my own half sister is 20 years younger than me and I'm 33. Although my step mom was MUCH younger than what Adora would have been 14 years ago)

    I just think that regardless of whether Camille is or isn't her birth mother, it feels like they are intentionally hinting that she could be to keep the viewers guessing. It's hard for me to get over the gas station scene in particular.
  • edited July 2018
    ghm3 said:. 

    Edit: Also, if Camille is Amma's mother than she was ~24 when she was conceived. Not exactly super scandalous even if this took place decades ago, and I can't imagine Camille staying in Wind Gap a day longer than she'd need to, so she would've what, shown up one day and dropped off her kid to be raised as her half-sister? I can't imagine the whole town not knowing if something like that happened.  
    Did they say how old Camille is? They probably did, but I missed it. I figured early to mid 30s. But the older you make Camille, the more that ages Adora, which makes it more unlikely that Amma is her biological daughter. (Yes I know it can happen, since my own half sister is 20 years younger than me and I'm 33. Although my step mom was MUCH younger than what Adora would have been 14 years ago)

    I just think that regardless of whether Camille is or isn't her birth mother, it feels like they are intentionally hinting that she could be to keep the viewers guessing. It's hard for me to get over the gas station scene in particular.
    I don't think it told us yet or showed a way to know for sure, but she seems about 40 to me and I think most others agree based on comments. But even if she's 35 that still puts her at 19-20, which doesn't really change anything.
  • JoshTheBlackJoshTheBlack Atlanta, GA
    I have the distinct feeling that Camille’s dearly departed sister’s illness was the result of munchausen by proxy. 

    @JaimieT I could totally see Jackie being a barely closeted lesbian, but she could also just be a master manipulator. Maybe she reads Camille’s lack of a committed relationship and “big city life” as hints she’s a lesbian and is playing to that for some reason. Maybe to try and stay in the loop on her investigation. 
  • Garthgou81Garthgou81 Placerville, CA
    I have the distinct feeling that Camille’s dearly departed sister’s illness was the result of munchausen by proxy. 


    Ya know, I hadn't thought of that and really am disappointed that I hadn't. There are tons of warning signs based on her mom's behavior that this could be the case. 
  • HunkuleseHunkulese Québec, Canada
    I wonder if we're going to end up with a Hot Fuzz like ending and the whole town is in on it. Everyone in the town is super weird and suspicious and more concerned about the town's reputation than figuring anything out. The victims were from outcast families and Camille and the out of town asshole are the only people investigating at all.
  • I have the distinct feeling that Camille’s dearly departed sister’s illness was the result of munchausen by proxy. 

    @JaimieT I could totally see Jackie being a barely closeted lesbian, but she could also just be a master manipulator. Maybe she reads Camille’s lack of a committed relationship and “big city life” as hints she’s a lesbian and is playing to that for some reason. Maybe to try and stay in the loop on her investigation. 
    Yeah I indirectly referenced this in the last page, it's what that HBO documentary Mommy Dead and Dearest is about and this show reminded me of that, @telephoneofmadness's description is spot on. 

    I just really hope that we don't get an everyone-is-in-on-it ending, or a True Detective occultish ending. The former doesn't make sense to me (beyond the obvious) for the same reason that Adora as a suspect doesn't make sense to me; it's too high profile, Adora/ Wind Gap would never want the scandal of being known everywhere as that place where girls are murdered.

    All I know is if we get a diner scene in a week or two and there's a Russian cook with an lingering shot of him a beat too long then it's totally him. 

  • I am kind of surprised that no one else has noticed Adora's own self-injurious behavior. The show has made a point multiple times of showing her pulling out her eyelashes. There is a flashback scene to the younger sisters funeral where Camille picks up the eyelashes that her mom has pulled out. For anyone who wants further information it appears quite obvious that Adora likely suffers from "trichotillomania" or hair pulling disorder (http://www.bfrb.org/learn-about-bfrbs/trichotillomania). According to the DSM (diagnostic manual for psychologists) this is consider a type of self-harm. I haven't quite figured out what the purpose of Adora suffering from this disorder is quite yet or how it will tie in. Also in the scene right before the husband starts playing the French music and tries to get Adora to dance with him she is pulling at her eyelashes and says "Stop, you don't want to be a hairless cat." Curious to hear what others think
    majjam0770
  • I am kind of surprised that no one else has noticed Adora's own self-injurious behavior. The show has made a point multiple times of showing her pulling out her eyelashes. There is a flashback scene to the younger sisters funeral where Camille picks up the eyelashes that her mom has pulled out. For anyone who wants further information it appears quite obvious that Adora likely suffers from "trichotillomania" or hair pulling disorder (http://www.bfrb.org/learn-about-bfrbs/trichotillomania). According to the DSM (diagnostic manual for psychologists) this is consider a type of self-harm. I haven't quite figured out what the purpose of Adora suffering from this disorder is quite yet or how it will tie in. Also in the scene right before the husband starts playing the French music and tries to get Adora to dance with him she is pulling at her eyelashes and says "Stop, you don't want to be a hairless cat." Curious to hear what others think
    Another dark triad person in my family used to pull out his eyelashes. Maybe it's part of the pathology.
  • ghm3 said:

    Have you seen Mommy Dead and Dearest on HBO? That doc will turn your stomach.
    I haven't seen it. I checked Wikipedia, it's a sad story. I guess using illness as a manipulation tool must be a common dark triad strategy.
  • cdrivecdrive Houston, TX
    People are catching some good shit on reddit, man.  Like the SCARED / SACRED thing.  I knew I saw SCARED first so I'm glad that's confirmed.  But yeah the HOPE / HURT switch on the funeral banner was one I just saw reddit folks call out.  I dig it.  This show is going to be loaded with weird clues and hidden details. 

    And her scar that looks like it says:
    ENTICE
    FORNICATE

    ....
    WTFingF?!?!

    Michelle
  • MichelleMichelle California
    I am kind of surprised that no one else has noticed Adora's own self-injurious behavior. The show has made a point multiple times of showing her pulling out her eyelashes. There is a flashback scene to the younger sisters funeral where Camille picks up the eyelashes that her mom has pulled out. For anyone who wants further information it appears quite obvious that Adora likely suffers from "trichotillomania" or hair pulling disorder (http://www.bfrb.org/learn-about-bfrbs/trichotillomania). According to the DSM (diagnostic manual for psychologists) this is consider a type of self-harm. I haven't quite figured out what the purpose of Adora suffering from this disorder is quite yet or how it will tie in. Also in the scene right before the husband starts playing the French music and tries to get Adora to dance with him she is pulling at her eyelashes and says "Stop, you don't want to be a hairless cat." Curious to hear what others think
    Another dark triad person in my family used to pull out his eyelashes. Maybe it's part of the pathology.
    A cousin of mine used to deal with trichotillomania, in that she used to pull out strands of her hair.   A few times we noticed that she had obvious bald patches at the top of her head, but she always tried to cover it up with a different hairstyle or a hat or cap.  Coincidentally, she had a high amount of anxiety for quite a while during that time, but she goes to therapy now and we haven't noticed it happening in a long time.  In researching it back then when a lot of us caught on to what she was doing, we read that it can be triggered by anxiety or other states of unrest, but also sometimes out of boredom or just a need to feel in control of something.   There is apparently an odd satisfaction in doing it. although there is embarassment at the result.  Relating that to this show, I can see how it makes sense for Adora since her mental anguish/unrest is at a pretty high level and she seems like the type who always needs/wants to be in total control, and she always seems to be pulling eyelashes in moments when she really seems to need comfort. 
  • I have the distinct feeling that Camille’s dearly departed sister’s illness was the result of munchausen by proxy.
    Are you saying that Camille sees dead people?!!
  • edited July 2018
    Damn 2 episodes in and I can’t find anything remotely interesting about this story. 

    I thought maybe it was because I’m going in blind and know nothing of the book(s?) but I see there is many people that are in the same boat and really like it. 

    I’m scratching my head trying to figure out what other people are seeing that I’m not *shugs* 

    I’m not trying to bash your show, I’m glad you all like it. I’m just genuinely confused about what’s the big deal. 
    Dee
  • JaimieTJaimieT Atlanta, GA
    Damn 2 episodes in and I can’t find anything remotely interesting about this story. 

    I thought maybe it was because I’m going in blind and know nothing of the book(s?) but I see there is many people that are in the same boat and really like it. 

    I’m scratching my head trying to figure out what other people are seeing that I’m not *shugs* 

    I’m not trying to bash your show, I’m glad you all like it. I’m just genuinely confused about what’s the big deal. 

    You probably don't find psychology interesting, yes? Most of it is happening on that level. True drama.
  • DeeDee Adelaide
    Damn 2 episodes in and I can’t find anything remotely interesting about this story. 

    I thought maybe it was because I’m going in blind and know nothing of the book(s?) but I see there is many people that are in the same boat and really like it. 

    I’m scratching my head trying to figure out what other people are seeing that I’m not *shugs* 

    I’m not trying to bash your show, I’m glad you all like it. I’m just genuinely confused about what’s the big deal. 
    I’m with you - I was bored shitless. It was so dark and mopey and long stretches of her doing nothing but drinking out of those little bottles just reminded me of an Intervention episode I saw once. I read the book years ago and had completely forgotten the story but it all came back to me watching the first episode so I know what happens anyway. This is not for me. 
    NervousRhino
  • @Dee yeah not for me either which is sad bc I really wanted to like it. It just blew my mind because usually when I don’t like a show that’s popular or gets good reviews I at least get why other people like it and realize it’s just not for me. With this one I just can’t figure out why anyone would find it appealing. I mean that literally, not in a rude way. 

    @JaimieT That could be part of the problem. I don’t find psychology boring but I don’t find it all that fascinating on tv in high doses either I suppose. I guess it depends on how it’s being presented. This just seems like a slow kind of weird random mess. I think I’m finally burnt out on the slow build up kind of shows especially if I’m watching week to week. I’m over the whole grinding to finales to get some shocking payoff. I’m demanding quicker returns lol. 
    Dee
  • JaimieTJaimieT Atlanta, GA
    @NervousRhino Yeah, that makes sense. I could not see another episode of Sharp Objects and be glad I watched these two because the character drama is so well done, the people feel so real. But that's my cup of tea and there are many other more plot-based shows that make me want to die.
    NervousRhino
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