BlacKkKlansman - This is why I'm happy to be in Club Baldmove

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  • I was sitting next to your counter-part during the movie, in a mostly white audience when I saw the film. No, I was not mad at the people in the audience because they're white. I don't think they needed to feel guilty bc of events that may have happened in the past. My feelings were mostly about the present...I think we ALL should feel guilty for not doing more to prevent the situation we "are-ruh" in the present. Full disclosure: I was a little mad about the young white couple next to me that said they now need to go see "Do the Right Thing" and "Malcolm X" (how many years later?). WTF were they waiting for, as those are acclaimed films?? 

    I thought the movie was very good. I don't know if it will win Best Picture, but I'd be pretty upset if it wasn't nominated. I loved the early tie-in with "The Wire." Given how the main story ended, I felt like that connection was so appropriate. The shit is institutional, which is why it keeps happening. My only real gripe with the movie itself is that the only real threat was Felix. Most of the Klan were made out to be bumbling hicks, which I think is a) a dangerous stereotype and b) takes away from the actual stakes in the movie. These people, IRL, are dangerous, intelligent, and organized (think American History X). Like Inglorious Basterds, the movie almost made the villians mustache-twirly buffoonish caricatures at times. And like Black Panther, the reaction to this movie is almost as important as the movie itself. I'm not sure there was a dry eye in the house at the end. Knowing how Spike likes to do, I fully expected him to insert some footage from Charlottesville or some Trump footage in. I also expected it to come off as either cheesy, manipulative, or brow-beating. It did not. As I was watching it, I kept thinking, "This is real. Real life. Real consequences. This girl really died, and it might have been preventable. And it might keep happening. It might happen Sunday." 

    As for me, @A_Ron_Hubbard nailed it when he quoted someone as saying "I'm tired." I can effectively remember about 35 years of my life. I've seen "Do the Right Thing" played out over and over (in the news) more times than I can count. Tired of reading about black leaders sought out and assassinated (in actuality or metaphorically).  I am tired of walking around black. Do I need to constantly go through life worrying about someone coming after my family, cops pulling me over, bosses/peers not thinking I deserve what I've earned, etc., etc. Not that these things even happen regularly, but they happen enough that it's a constant stressor. I just want to be a person that only has the normal stress everyone deals with (job, family, health, etc.). And that is the weight...because you even though you eventually adapt and get stronger for carrying it, it still makes you tired.
    voodooratEine FrauAvienndhaDeeKingKobraBhorten1A_Ron_HubbardchriszahnerAmbitiousBukky

  • Absolutely one of your best episodes! Yes, it's important to listen to and amplify the voices of the marginalized. But in reality, we won't be able to achieve true equality without the help of white allies. Btw, that actress is not the same young lady from the Leftovers. This actress is named Laura Harrier. The one from the Leftovers is named Jasmine Savoy Brown.
    I talked about this on lunch re: Ms. Harrier, but, boy is my face red. 
    Don't feel bad. There was another recent thing I saw where I thought it was Evie. Maybe the Handmaid's Tale...I can't remember. It happens.
    chriszahner
  • Wow  ... awesome! “If you have the privilege to be able to put your fingers in your ears and go lalaala nowadays beacause you don’t want to hear about politics, that’s the very definition of white privilege” Great pod guys! 
    Thank you guys for this. I have some ‘both sides are awful’ friends and I need to be tougher. This is gold. 

    And thank you to Jim and Aron for putting this out there. It made my heart full to know you guys are in the fight and willing to talk about about all this. It’s exhausting to follow it each day but I feel it is so important and it makes it just a tiny bit easier knowing you guys are doing it too. I would love if you had a politics podcast....just sayin’...
    DeeCretanBullA_Ron_Hubbardchriszahner
  • cdrivecdrive Houston, TX
    edited August 2018
    @walkthesky Hey man...I told you where I’m from. You quoted where I told you where I’m from. It’s also next to my handle.  I think Blue Lives Matter is an insult to honorable policemen.  It was born in bad faith and plays as a counter to Black Lives Matter.  You’re from NY, no? So you know its origin.  It’s from Eric Garner repeatedly begging “I can’t breathe” as he got choked to death for selling loosies. Cigarettes for a quarter. Coroner ruled it a homocide. Cop went to desk duty, got a raise, got married since then. Black Live Matter illuminated it. Some crazy guy there shot police officers. No one condones shooting police officers, but racists know they can twist it into that false dichotomy by playing off Black LM with a counter Blue LM.  Just google Blue Lives Matter and you have blue lines going through Confederate flags, All Lives Matter signs, and their favorite the Punisher skull.  The Punisher’s ethos should never enter a Venn diagram with responsible law enforcement.  Down here, Blue Lives Matter stickers didn’t just magically start appearing on cars that already had 10+ years worth of stacked 100 club stickers. We already have organizations supporting the blue. They go next to confederate flag stickers and Trump stickers.  If people truly believe Blue Lives Matter they need to get behind Black Lives Matter, acknowledge the problem and stop protecting the broken status quo in policing.  
    johnnytruantCretanBullEine FrauJayland86
  • GeorgeGeorge Astoria, New York
    edited August 2018
    I appreciate this community so much.

    Great pod. It’s refreshing to hear the perspective.
    Drewchriszahner
  • DrewDrew indianapolis
    edited August 2018
    I don't get on here much anymore, just out of lack of time, but I wanted to show my support for the boys on this Cast.  Fucking love you guys and I have no doubts about moving money around every February to show you guys support!

    PS, going to bamboozle my Conservative friend into seeing this movie.

    I'm listening to this podcast as I type and I feel ashamed for not doing anything, fucking world is going to hell because of people like me.  I was arrested for possession of weed, don't think I don't know I wouldn't have been fucked if I had been black.  I live in a small town like that depicted in Sharp Objects, don't think I don't feel like shit that the mother of my kids is fighting custody so she can raise our kids in a fucking school system that has MAYBE one black child in a class.  I feel so fucking dirty after listening to this podcast.
    GeorgeA_Ron_HubbardMurderbearchriszahner
  • So I'm typically only on the forums off and on through the week when I'm at work and I just had quite the task of getting caught up in this thread and it's ugly brothers thread that got started.  I have yet to listen to the podcast because I would really like to see the movie first and I didn't get a chance to over the weekend but I can already tell I'm going to be extremely happy with the coverage.  I might just listen to it today or tomorrow anyways because I'm not quite sure when I will be able to get out and see it and clearly this is a big moment in the Bald Move community. 
  • JaimieTJaimieT Atlanta, GA
    So I'm typically only on the forums off and on through the week when I'm at work and I just had quite the task of getting caught up in this thread and it's ugly brothers thread that got started.  I have yet to listen to the podcast because I would really like to see the movie first and I didn't get a chance to over the weekend but I can already tell I'm going to be extremely happy with the coverage.  I might just listen to it today or tomorrow anyways because I'm not quite sure when I will be able to get out and see it and clearly this is a big moment in the Bald Move community. 

    I listened to it first and saw the movie afterward. I'm sensitive about spoilers and nothing felt spoiled for me. They do "spoil" 1 aspect that might bother some, so do it at your own risk, but it didn't bother me at all.
    awookiee
  • This was a great episode. Haven't seen the film but really enjoyed the discussion. I live in the UK, but a lot of what was said applies over here too. Where I live, the racism is directed in a different direction (more towards asians i.e. Pakistanis) and I'm frequently hearing causal racism in my day to day life. As a white English guy, I've been grappling a lot with this idea of white guilt, as the history of this little island is as littered with heinous cases of racism as anywhere. 

    It's hard to stand up against racism sometimes, but this podcast reminded me to try harder. Burying our heads in the sand is almost paramount to partaking in the racism ourselves. We have to remember to speak up, and if we don't we should know that we're no better than the overt racists, fascists and nazis who we find so disturbing.

    chriszahner
  • MichaelVCassidyMichaelVCassidy Harrisburg, Pa
    Dee said:
    Wow, that was BLISTERING. Poor @Jim getting interrupted every time though, lol. 

    I still know nothing about this movie from this review but I sure as hell want to see it. 
    I hate that I do that. I really do. It's so painful to listen to. Knowing my tendency to do that shit in even normal, less emotionally charged circumstances, I fully intended to just let him speak for the first five minutes. I had thought about that plan the whole drive back to the studio; "I'm going to just let him run and just be like "amen!", "preach!"", etc. But then  60 seconds into the cast I'm like That's nice of you, A.ron - but I dont want you to ever hold back a thought or opinion. You are so spot on and enlightening when you speak that it would be a shame to miss some of them by conceding to Jim. Jim is a great dude, but dosen't quite have the ability to verbalize his thoughts as well as you do. (Few do) Fitting you're a Gift of Gab fan (I liked you already, but when I heard you were a Blackalicious fan, I think we became best friends without you knowing it) haha.

    Seriously though, the pod is the best you two have ever done and you both impressed me and encouraged me with your thoughts. I hope there are more white people out there who see the world the way Jim and yourself do. 

    I'm glad you made the pod available for all non club members too. I was able to share it with many people who dont know anything about bald move. Thanks to you both
    chriszahner
  • bizmarkiefaderbizmarkiefader San Francisco
    Amazing cast guys, I hope other people come out of it feeling the same way you do.

    When we went to see this movie at 1pm at a small-ish theater we got stuck behind a gaggle of a surprising number of old white people and some of their families and we were trying to figure out what they were here for. Right down the fucking hall another theater was showing 'Death of a Nation' of all movies at the same time as BK, a movie where they spell out the history of the movie that title is playing off of. I really hope the theater just takes their money and shows BK instead.
  • bizmarkiefaderbizmarkiefader San Francisco
    Also, I would love to hear @A_Ron_Hubbard thoughts on the brilliant Sorry to Bother You, you could do another 2 hours just on the role capitalism plays in this discussion. Between those two movies in the last month I feel like I'm thiiiiiiis close to radicalizing my girlfriend.
    CretanBullchriszahner
  • Today I saw BlacKKKlansman and it was incredible, then when I’d pulled myself together enough I went out to the car and cried there for a while.  Afterwards I picked up my son and went to go vote in the Wisconsin primary, for a moment it felt like I had the power to change the system there in my hands.  And the whole time I was thinking of Jesse Washington and Heather Heyer.
    JaimieTcdriveCretanBullDemicA_Ron_HubbardrkcrawfchriszahnerMichelle
  • Just listened to the podcast and read through the entire feed to see how moved everyone including myself was by this review. I teach middle school in Brooklyn and surprisingly enough most of the staff are conservative Republican MAGA supporters - which makes going to work a big challenge some days. I have lost so much respect for so many of my colleagues, who day in and out teach children of all races, creeds and walks of life. 

    I don’t know if anyone else feels this way, but as a white woman I feel that people have felt more free in recent years to spew racist nonsense to me and expect me to just agree with them. When did this happen and has anyone else noticed it or am I giving off an “it’s ok to be racist to me vibe?” Have people always been this racist or is it a new found well of hate and vitriol? 

    Though I haven’t seen the movie, when Jim mentioned guilt I couldn’t empathize more. I feel guilty all the time and I have lost my ability to feel comfortable with my black brothers and sisters because much of the time I just want to apologize for all of history and I wonder how much they must hate me for all they have had to endure.  I just feel completely hopeless and helpless for the state of our country.  And this leads me to my final questions - what can we do? Where can we start? How do I fight back? How can I raise my baby son to not be corrupted by all of these forces? 
    FreibergFlukesrusskellyCretanBullA_Ron_HubbardEine Frauchriszahner
  • russkellyrusskelly Indianapolis
    @Chrissy1125 I'm half Filipino and I have had people think it's ok to be racist around me too, so it's definitely not you.
    CretanBullFreiberg
  • Just listened to the podcast and read through the entire feed to see how moved everyone including myself was by this review. I teach middle school in Brooklyn and surprisingly enough most of the staff are conservative Republican MAGA supporters - which makes going to work a big challenge some days. I have lost so much respect for so many of my colleagues, who day in and out teach children of all races, creeds and walks of life. 

    I don’t know if anyone else feels this way, but as a white woman I feel that people have felt more free in recent years to spew racist nonsense to me and expect me to just agree with them. When did this happen and has anyone else noticed it or am I giving off an “it’s ok to be racist to me vibe?” Have people always been this racist or is it a new found well of hate and vitriol? 

    Though I haven’t seen the movie, when Jim mentioned guilt I couldn’t empathize more. I feel guilty all the time and I have lost my ability to feel comfortable with my black brothers and sisters because much of the time I just want to apologize for all of history and I wonder how much they must hate me for all they have had to endure.  I just feel completely hopeless and helpless for the state of our country.  And this leads me to my final questions - what can we do? Where can we start? How do I fight back? How can I raise my baby son to not be corrupted by all of these forces? 

    No, you're not the only one. I live in a rural, mostly white conservative area and I hear shockingly casual racist comments a lot.  I have no problem challenging someone who is talking to me or in a group, but I'm still trying to figure out the best approach with the overheard comment.  Obviously, they don't care that I can hear them, but they are not technically talking to me.  I think I should speak up, but how? 
  • Eine Frau said:
    Just listened to the podcast and read through the entire feed to see how moved everyone including myself was by this review. I teach middle school in Brooklyn and surprisingly enough most of the staff are conservative Republican MAGA supporters - which makes going to work a big challenge some days. I have lost so much respect for so many of my colleagues, who day in and out teach children of all races, creeds and walks of life. 

    I don’t know if anyone else feels this way, but as a white woman I feel that people have felt more free in recent years to spew racist nonsense to me and expect me to just agree with them. When did this happen and has anyone else noticed it or am I giving off an “it’s ok to be racist to me vibe?” Have people always been this racist or is it a new found well of hate and vitriol? 

    Though I haven’t seen the movie, when Jim mentioned guilt I couldn’t empathize more. I feel guilty all the time and I have lost my ability to feel comfortable with my black brothers and sisters because much of the time I just want to apologize for all of history and I wonder how much they must hate me for all they have had to endure.  I just feel completely hopeless and helpless for the state of our country.  And this leads me to my final questions - what can we do? Where can we start? How do I fight back? How can I raise my baby son to not be corrupted by all of these forces? 

    No, you're not the only one. I live in a rural, mostly white conservative area and I hear shockingly casual racist comments a lot.  I have no problem challenging someone who is talking to me or in a group, but I'm still trying to figure out the best approach with the overheard comment.  Obviously, they don't care that I can hear them, but they are not technically talking to me.  I think I should speak up, but how? 

    Well, shockingly casual to me, living in my white progressive personal bubble. 
  • Pretty annoyed that the movie was 5th last weekend...to movies that by most accounts are so-so. I get it, as it's late summer and people want to see shark movies. It's a lot to expect from people to want them to see a movie that might make them uncomfortable. Don't know if the movie was marketed well... hopefully, word of mouth picks up or people will rent it.
    DeeA_Ron_Hubbard
  • seanrayseanray Texas
    edited August 2018
    @rkcrawf I think that has a lot to do w/ it being in limited release. It just now got to my hometown this weekend, so let’s see where it is in the standings the next few weeks.
    CretanBullrkcrawf
  • Spike Lee's movies are usually pretty niche, has he ever had a #1 movie?
    Frakkin T
  • According to Box Office Mojo-
    He Got Game &
    Inside Man both opened at #1, those are the only ones I saw.
    CretanBullFrakkin T
  • Frakkin TFrakkin T Currently Offline
    Inside Man was DOPE. 
    Hatorianrkcrawf
  • seanray said:
    @rkcrawf I think that has a lot to do w/ it being in limited release. It just now got to my hometown this weekend, so let’s see where it is in the standings the next few weeks.
    Didn’t realize it was limited release. It’s in the few theaters I frequent, so I thought it was a regular release. 

    @CretanBull yeah, I guess I don’t think of them as niche, but that’s probably my own bubble. I felt like a lot of people saw Do the Right Thing and Malcolm X, but a) that was 20 years ago and b) they probably got more press than actual viewers. 

    Yes, Inside Man was the shit. 
  • chriskchrisk Indianapolis
    edited August 2018
    I think this is a pretty strong, cogent criticism from Boots Riley, the director of Sorry to Bother You. Doesn't take away (for me) what's good about BlackkKlansman, but they're valid points in terms of the actual history.



    A couple addendums:




  • russkellyrusskelly Indianapolis
    Hey everybody, haven't been following this thread. Not sure what you guys are currently talking about, but I just wanted to say that I just saw Blakkklanman, finally and it was good. It was good. I liked a lot of it, but I was hoping for more TBH. I thought some of the characters could have been used better. But did anyone see the trailer for the "Thug" movie The Hate we something... That movie looks legit. Carry on with your conversations. Have a nice day.
  • A_Ron_HubbardA_Ron_Hubbard Cincinnati, OH
    edited August 2018
    I saw that Boots Riley stuff going around yesterday. Interesting stuff. It seems most of what Spike did was hide or minimize the things Ron Stallsworth did that wouldn't fit in the vision of the narrative. The fact he did  years of work on COINTELPRO, doing the very sort of infiltration and destruction of black leadership I decried in our discussion. 

    So, it doesn't really change my opinion of the film and it's effect. The truth will always be a lot more disappointing and disillusioning than the cleaned up, fictionalized version. As I said in the review, the ending of the movie was uplifting and fun, but it was also clearly not an accurate picture of the reality, which is why the true end of the film featuring The Charlottesville imagry is valuable. Our last image leaving the theater shouldn't be a multiculural/multiracial police force taking down racists arm in arm with the support of society and the highest levels of government. A fine thing to aspire to, but it is not reality.
    Freibergrkcrawfchrisk
  • I have to throw out a book recommendation because it relates so directly to the conversation. The Warmth of Other Suns by Isabel Wilkerson is a history of the black experience in America post-slavery including share-cropping, Jim Crow, lynching etc. Its so poignant and devastating and yet also inspired me to be a more informed and active ally.  After hearing the true history of Jim Crow and lynching in particular  I realized my mostly-white public school education was woefully devoid of the true nature of our country post-slavery and pre-civil rights. How can we change the worst parts of ourselves if we don't first acknowledge them?
    CretanBullDeeEine Frau
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