Legion Season 2 Discussion - SPOILERS

TravisTravis CA
edited August 2018 in Other TV
Hi Guys,
I thought @A_Ron_Hubbard had mentioned wanting to do a cast discussing season 2 of Legion. I'm most of the way through it finally, and it's totally good, and I would love to hear it if it ever took place. Was there ever a season 2 cast? I didn't see anything in Bald Move TV, but I might have missed it.
Thanks!

Comments

  • I believe Aron did a guest spot on one of Jason's Podcastica episodes, but we never got any BMTV coverage that I'm aware of.  I doubt we'll get any coverage at this point, but I'm sure Aron will talk about it during the next Baldies...
    Travis
  • Aron did the premiere but didn't appear again on Jason's cast.  He said he tried to get something together but too much time passed at the end of the season.  

    What did you think of the season @Travis ?  I'm planning on rewatching it in a few months, was such a wild ride. 
    ElisaTravis
  • I really thought it was cool. Had some absolutely fascinating meandering and then had a real mindscrew end to the season that I thought was pretty well done. 
    ElisaTravis
  • I hated the end of the season. I thought the whole season up to that point was really borderline brilliant and nearly the entire final episode was garbage and the particular flavor of the finalmind-fuck was unnecessary at best, distasteful at the worst. I love the show regardless and will be back for season 3 and really would like for BM coverage to return or at least for A-Ron to get more involved with the Podcastica (yawn) cast
    ElisaTravis
  • Thanks for starting this thread.  Needed to be done.

    I agree, most of the season was brilliant.  Beautifully shot and scored, and the twisty, tangential mid season episodes were some of the best hours of TV this year.

    I also agree that it fell flat when it came to the last couple of episodes.  Future Syd’s Prophecy (FSP (tm)) didn’t really come together cleanly.  I really expected a moment of “oh shit!  That’s what it meant!  Could I have seen that coming?”

    And similarly, there should have been some earlier hint of the turn that David would take at the end.  I’m trying not to get too spoilery yet.  Maybe I’ll let this thread percolate for a week or so and then come back for theories about what led to that final turn of events.

    LOVE Lenny’s arc over the season, and how she almost forgot the important mega gun in the trunk of the burning car...  LOL

    ElisaTravis
  • Aron did the premiere but didn't appear again on Jason's cast.  He said he tried to get something together but too much time passed at the end of the season.  

    What did you think of the season @Travis ?  I'm planning on rewatching it in a few months, was such a wild ride. 
    Thanks for confirming that it never came together everybody. I will check out A.Ron's appearance for the premier. It's a bummer. I would have loved coverage, but of course I get it. Not like they don't have a shit ton of balls in the air. 

    I really, really liked it. We just finished it last night and I'm still doing some sorting of my thoughts about the end. I suspect that I liked it more than some, but I do feel like it could have been better. The season as a whole though was goddamn amazing. Man, I just love the perspective of it. The feel of it. You just don't get enough well done psychedelic television (I guess would be a way to put it). I kind of feel like watching Legion is more like listening to music than watching a show (I wonder if that is a sort of aim of theirs given the clear importance that the show puts on music). It's a different experience than pretty much any other TV. 

    I loved all of the Jon Hamm narrative stuff and how they depicted it. That whole running theme as ideas as viruses was very cool to play around with. I particularly loved the bit about people watching the world as shadows in a cave brought into people's sort of cell phone filters. All of those bits, and the stand alone episode with the "madness creature" was just outstanding. 

    For the sake of the ending, I was a little bit let down. I kind of thought the conclusion was going to be a bit less straight forward and I kind of wish they had played their hand a little differently, but I do think it sets up and AMAZING season 3. I am very confused at how The Shadow King somehow now has a "seat at the table." I mean, he is still who he is. I thought that, despite how it worked specifically in the vacuum of that scene, makes zero sense and is a bit frustrating. And for what it's worth in defense of the overall ending (SK bit aside), David did do what he did to Syd. That's a fact. 

    Anyhoo, a ton of thoughts, but I really love the show and I really loved the season. Man, I wish they had covered it.
    Elisa
  • Doctor_NickDoctor_Nick Terminus
    edited August 2018
    Yes, that is disturbing and should give the viewers pause, shouldn't it, even if we think we know what David did to Syd?  And what do we really know about how clear headed future Syd was?

    Travis said:
     I am very confused at how The Shadow King somehow now has a "seat at the table." I mean, he is still who he is. I thought that, despite how it worked specifically in the vacuum of that scene, makes zero sense and is a bit frustrating. And for what it's worth in defense of the overall ending (SK bit aside), David did do what he did to Syd. That's a fact. 


     
    TravisElisa
  • Travis said:
    I am very confused at how The Shadow King somehow now has a "seat at the table." I mean, he is still who he is. I thought that, despite how it worked specifically in the vacuum of that scene, makes zero sense and is a bit frustrating. And for what it's worth in defense of the overall ending (SK bit aside), David did do what he did to Syd. That's a fact.
    I think it's a case of "better the devil you know". Destroying the world is not an option for Farouk because he wants to rule it. And Farouk is weaker than David, so after Farouk helps contain David Division 3 might be able to take down Farouk too.
    TravisElisa
  • Not "the devil you know." Because the characters all know David who has now become that "devil." It's now the devil poorly understood to stop the devil you know. In fact anything to stop our now tainted would be savior. 

    RE: earlier comments implying that what we see happening between David and Syd potentially not being accurate... that is a bridge to far to say the least. They planted that  flag resolutely between future and present Syd and to try and recontextualize it now would ring not only false but cowardly in that they went bold (and in my opinion failed horrendously). I should point out that while I have read far too many comic books, I have never read these so if that was the required impetus of this divergence please let me know as that would put things in a different light to some extent.
    Travis
  • Doctor_NickDoctor_Nick Terminus
    edited August 2018
    We see David edit present Syd. We don’t know what the Shadow King really actually did to Syd. Then we saw the Shadow King sending out little minions into the Division before what ends up being David’s Trial.  We don’t exactly know what those minions did.  

    Nowhere in this season do I remember any vetting of future Syd’s story - she is just believed at face value. We don’t know that she’s not under Farouk’s influence. We don’t know that this is not a self fulfilling time loop prophecy. Tell
    present David to help the present Shadow King so future Shadow King is empowered because they know David will go off the reservation. 
    ElisaByrdieTravis
  • All valid and good points. I guess my assumption has been that this show was taking David down the dark path towards at best anti-hero status but likely a good stretch of pure villainy. A direction I am, for the record, very much here for. What rubbed me the wrong way was imo a cheap use of sexual assault to flip David to the dark side. Because even if he was manipulated by a Farouk controlled future Syd (likely) he made that choice. I'm curious what the comic canon is for this moment if it is even present. 
    Travis
  • TravisTravis CA
    edited August 2018
    We see David edit present Syd. We don’t know what the Shadow King really actually did to Syd. Then we saw the Shadow King sending out little minions into the Division before what ends up being David’s Trial.  We don’t exactly know what those minions did.  

    Nowhere in this season do I remember any vetting of future Syd’s story - she is just believed at face value. We don’t know that she’s not under Farouk’s influence. We don’t know that this is not a self fulfilling time loop prophecy. Tell
    present David to help the present Shadow King so future Shadow King is empowered because they know David will go off the reservation. 
    I had similar wonderings about Future Syd possibly being under the influence of SK. I was actually a little disappointed when everything started tying together and that wasn't the "poisoned idea." I thought that would be a very interesting hole to go down. I do still kind of wonder what the point of his mouse whispering to Syd, though I had thought it was to wake her up from what David had done to her both to spite David and to give him an advantage/distraction. Before David violated her memories (and actually even after, figuring that would be a new and different thing to deal with), I thought this was going to resolve with them all finding out that the whole situation was a manipulation of his making. I know that doesn't really jive with SK's revelation when he visited Future Syd, but I still kind of held out for it. It's true though, I kept wondering how in this world where people can turn into other people or take control of them how Future Syd's narrative was never really questioned. I do wonder if given the fact that Future Syd's presence and her mission really is still what put David's downfall into motion if they might not revisit all of it next season. I doubt it. I think it's kind of a closed book, but it's certainly possible that there is more to it.

    Byrdie said:
    Not "the devil you know." Because the characters all know David who has now become that "devil." It's now the devil poorly understood to stop the devil you know. In fact anything to stop our now tainted would be savior. 

    RE: earlier comments implying that what we see happening between David and Syd potentially not being accurate... that is a bridge to far to say the least. They planted that  flag resolutely between future and present Syd and to try and recontextualize it now would ring not only false but cowardly in that they went bold (and in my opinion failed horrendously). I should point out that while I have read far too many comic books, I have never read these so if that was the required impetus of this divergence please let me know as that would put things in a different light to some extent.
    I may be getting lost in the wording, and I apologize if I am, but I agree that they can't have any take backs on David's manipulation of Syd, and I don't think they are going to try. He clearly did it and he clearly feels shame about it (as of course he should). I think this show is too good to attempt some sort of "it was an outside manipulation" sort of thing. It would clearly go against what played out on the screen.
    ElisaByrdie
  • With the SK's "seat at the table," I mean I do get that they have aligned interests that are pretty clear. I guess it was just kind of jarring to see him without any sort of halo or just sort of wandering freely. It would be one thing if they had spent more time with him, and I guess he could have planted seeds through the mouse, but where they clearly showed it happening with Syd, I don't think they earned that potential plot on screen. I mean, I get it (at least to the extent of their possible motives, enough to not make it completely egregious). I just didn't really like it. I mean, he is still way more powerful than anyone aside from David and they're not protected from him at all. A lot of trust that immediately built. I know that you also would blow the reveal by adding air to the situation. I don't know, it just felt really clunky to me.
  • TravisTravis CA
    edited August 2018
    Byrdie said:
    All valid and good points. I guess my assumption has been that this show was taking David down the dark path towards at best anti-hero status but likely a good stretch of pure villainy. A direction I am, for the record, very much here for. What rubbed me the wrong way was imo a cheap use of sexual assault to flip David to the dark side. Because even if he was manipulated by a Farouk controlled future Syd (likely) he made that choice. I'm curious what the comic canon is for this moment if it is even present. 
    I definitely see what you're saying now, and after spinning around in my head a lot on it I agree. I had thought that they did play it out effectively. I mean when she says "you drugged me and you had sex with me" it REALLY lands like a KO punch, but, and I do think it's a tough line because you are dealing with an insane, delusional person, it does feel a bit like it's more ambiguous than it should be whether you are meant to feel any sympathy for him. He wears a bit of shame for a couple of brief times, and you can see her statement hit him, but ultimately it's just "screw you guys. I'm out of here." That said, he is a villain now. I think it's super complicated and such a tough line for the creators to walk, but I definitely see what you're saying and I'm glad you said it.
    ElisaByrdie
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