4.08 Coushatta

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  • Garthgou81Garthgou81 Placerville, CA

    P.S.   Mike’s reaction to Gus killing Victor is a non-issue, Gus potentially had known Victor way longer than Mike and no matter what atrocities Mike may have viewed Gus accomplish in the past, self preservation will always take over in the moment... Mike was not reacting to what Gus was doing but who he was doing it too
    Yeah, I mentioned this last week I believe. Mike had no reason to think that Victor, a loyal soldier, was about to be nixed. Just as Jesse/Walt would have been less shocked if either one of them would have been murdered. Killing Victor just does not compute in the moment for any of them. He isn't shocked by the act, but the person. 

    What I will say is that the only way the "change" in Gus's character has affected me is that I always saw him as a mild-mannered dude. So it is kind of a cool thought experiment to imagine that the frustration of Gus working with Walt brought out the inner gangster that was hidden to us until he sort of breaks bad. However the reality is to get where Gus is, he has to have gotten his hands dirty in the past. 
    j0n1c4
  • When Werner was talking about his father being the architect who designed the Sydney Opera House, I was drawn back to the scene a few episodes ago when Mike finally called BS on the guy who always lies at the grief counseling sessions. It's usually tougher for me to tell exactly what Mike is thinking - maybe I should say it's tougher for me to determine exactly why Mike is scowling. Anyway, Mike could easily do a bit of research to learn who really designed the Opera House. If so, he would learn that the architect was actually from Denmark and had two sons, neither of whom are named Werner. Although maybe a bit obvious, that would be another reason for Mike to scowl at Werner, and maybe do a bit more.
  • DeeDee Adelaide
    BigSwifty said:
    When Werner was talking about his father being the architect who designed the Sydney Opera House, I was drawn back to the scene a few episodes ago when Mike finally called BS on the guy who always lies at the grief counseling sessions. It's usually tougher for me to tell exactly what Mike is thinking - maybe I should say it's tougher for me to determine exactly why Mike is scowling. Anyway, Mike could easily do a bit of research to learn who really designed the Opera House. If so, he would learn that the architect was actually from Denmark and had two sons, neither of whom are named Werner. Although maybe a bit obvious, that would be another reason for Mike to scowl at Werner, and maybe do a bit more.
    He said his father was an engineer and he “built” the Sydney Opera House. I don’t think he was implying he designed it. He talked about his father having to figure out how to pour the concrete, so it was more that someone else designed it and his father had to figure out how to make that design work. I don’t think he was lying, it sounds like his dad was just one of the (fictional) leads on the actual building project. 
    FreddyBigSwifty
  • I've always hoped Kim it turns out was there all along and we just didnt "see" her in Breaking Bad. I think that there's lots of evidence that Kim not only enjoys the con-man side of Jimmy but I don't think we've ever seen her really that into him when he's tryin to be a good upstanding solid citizen. That whole Giselle scam is proof she's Bonnie to his Clyde. She's bored with her life and with him when they're both on the straight and narrow. She wants to stand outside and smoke cigarettes and plan plots and plot plans with him. She was looking for some excitement when she started doing PD work because Mesa Verde bores her to tears, but she didn't get her interest in Jimmy back until she found out he *wasn't* on the up-and-up afterall. She likes Jimmy shady because she likes a bad boy, and she can't find a thrill in living her boring mundane safe life. I think they make a great pair. I hope we find out she's in Gene's life. I've always wanted that. 
  • jtmy92 said:
    ^ all of this. I am finding myself a little perplexed by Jim and Aron's hang ups with many of these points...nothing wrong with that of course, but I think for me at least, this is the first time in the 8 years I have been a BaldMove listener that I so strongly disagree with their takes.
    I agree with this. I am really enjoying this season (the quality of this show is top tier), and have been surprised that Jim and A.ron seem to be disappointed so far. Still loving the podcast of course.
    Yeah, same exact situation for me. I was listening to the podcast and I thought my opinion on the episode was so different from the one from Jim and A. Ron that I had to immediately come here to confirm if anyone had the same thoughts. I still think the average level of the show is just as high as it always has been (even if this season still didn't reach the peaks of episodes like Chicanery or Five-o). However, the tone of the podcast appears to be a much more negative one than usual.

    It seems that Jim and A.Ron are going into episodes with a little less patience than usual, making them have a lower tolerance for longer scenes (at least for the first watch, since last week they actually said the second watch was much better).
    Myself, I really loved the initial scene with Jimmy in the bus and how it took its time to show the viewers all the time and effort that Jimmy had to put into that plan (kind of like previous seasons montages with Mike, like the one with him disassembling his car looking for any trackers).

    As for the Kim twist, I also don't agree that it is unbelievably out of character. We already knew she didn't feel satisfied with her work for Mesa Verde and how bored she felt (hence the pro-bono work). Once she did the con with Jimmy, I can see how she could have felt a level of excitement that she hadn't felt for a really long time.
    Here, I think that it is also really important that the "Let's do it again" moment is something that she clearly put quite a bit of thought into, and that ultimately she made that decision for herself and not for Jimmy.

    MurderbearMrXhypergenesbjtmy92
  • ChinaskiChinaski Santa Cruz, CA
    Kim listens  to Stereolab.. and with headphones  <3
    MrXMurderbear
  • Frakkin TFrakkin T Currently Offline
    edited September 2018
    I feel like we've been through this before, in Breaking Bad when Mike abandoned his granddaughter at the park rather than get collared. It seemed out of character for us but Jonathan Banks himself made the point that maybe we didn't know Mike as well as we thought we did. 

    Right before Kim said 'let's do it again,' Jimmy explained to her what he thought she was thinking, and 'let's do it again' was a complete shock to him, and to us, because we realize at that point that Kim likes the danger. It completely changes the expectations for the endgame. If Kim is not a criminal, the story is either 1) Kim & Jimmy part ways because he's full Saul and she hates it or 2) Kim meets her end as collateral damage from blowback from something Jimmy does. Either one of those is terribly sad but also tragic, noble, & somewhat expected BUT what if Kim is a criminal? Then we see her corrupted by her own choice, a mini-breaking bad arc where she will be complicit in whatever happens to get us to Saul.

    It also allows us to retain empathy for Jimmy; Kim is BELOVED by fans and if he causes her death I'm not sure that doesn't alter how we view the character (aka make us hate him) across both shows.
    Dummy
  • Nacho has an amazing looking AMC Javelin AMX.  Though I think I prefer the first gen Javelin.
    Murderbear
  • Nacho ... I'm afraid trouble awaits you up in Canada too ... 


    Frakkin TDreamRycherBigSwifty
  • I also like the Kai red herring.  Werner will be the downfall of the Germans.
  • Garthgou81Garthgou81 Placerville, CA
    MrX said:
    Nacho ... I'm afraid trouble awaits you up in Canada too ... 


    It's concerning that one of Lalo's lines to Nacho is "you are going to die!" It was in response to how good the food is, but still. 
    HatorianMurderbearDoctor_NickKela15
  • Next weeks episode title translates to goodbye in German...
  • I really don't think that the Assistant DA is completely done with this... maybe she ends up taking a trip to Louisiana. 
    NervousRhino
  • That would be interesting. 
    Hatorian
  • Maybe Kim’s turn explains why, though she didn’t want Jimmy to tell her what he did to screw up Chuck’s Mesa Verde work, she has been fine with accepting the benefits of it.  Even in her regular dealings she may have not been as straight edge as she seemed. 
  • I made an account just to respond to the reaction to this episode as expressed in the instant take.  I was pretty surprised that Jim and A ron were so surprised by Kim.  I dont think its out of character for her at all.  Kim is complex, but she has ALWAYS been excited by this kind of stuff.  We've seen it when she acts as Giselle, we saw it when she took Chuck down at the bar hearing, and we are seeing it again here.  I dont think she would ever be willing to do such a thing to someone she perceived as innocent or in the right- but thats not what happened here.  I also think we have seen that she grows closer to Jimmy during these kinds of antics.  Sure- in the past she has felt guilty afterwards- but thats only afterwards.  If Kim wasnt into this kind of thing, she would have bailed from Jimmy a long time ago.
    bennytube
  • Natter CastNatter Cast San Francisco, CA
    Whenever Huell is the center of the story, easily dismissible fan theories that turn out to be true can't be far behind. Remember how none of us thought he could have lifted the cigarettes off Jesse?
  • chriskchrisk Indianapolis
    I also liked everything Jim and ARon didn't.  :)

    I've been very up and down on this show the whole time, and I haven't often had strong feelings about it. It's good enough that I keep watching, but Kim and Jimmy aren't terribly interesting as a normal couple. This is the first time in a while I felt like they belonged together and I cared where they go from here. I do feel like they have laid the groundwork in the past, and Kim's struggle is about what she "should" do vs. what she wants. She worked her ass off on Mesa Verde but ultimately found it unsatisfying. She's tried to be the adult in the relationship, but it seems like that's also taken a toll. I think she both likes the con game and likes Jimmy, so she's taking the path of least resistance. 

    I would agree it doesn't quite jibe with how frustrated she seemed at the end of the previous episode.

    I liked Jimmy's Creole accent - wasn't perfect, and he lapsed into some cliche, but I thought that was kind of intentional. I didn't see the attorney as dumb though, and I don't think she sympathized. She just realized this was developing into a potential headache.

    I liked the Kai/Werner twist if only because Werner is a better, more interesting character. It's a more mundane and believable way of them being discovered. Having said that, I don't really get how any of that shop talk comes back on them. I wasn't even sure he was describing the lab. Seemed more like Mike realized he liked to talk a bit too much. If they kill him based on this alone, I'll be disappointed. Seems like killing him is also a lot riskier, but we'll see.

    Wouldn't argue with anyone saying the genesis of the superlab isn't particularly interesting. 

    I think Nacho is planning to bolt once he thinks he has enough money. Might be that the house isn't actually *his*, and is more of a Salamanca asset, though it does seem a bit too conspicuous.

  • Natter CastNatter Cast San Francisco, CA
    Official prediction:

    Final scene of the series, Cinnabon Gene comes home after a hard day at work, sits down in his barcalounger, turns on 'To Kill a Mockingbird'...

    ... and then ..

    .. reaches up to the base of his neck and pulls off a rubber mask.

    Saul was Kim all along. 
    Murderbearbennytubedjcaudle01
  • MichelleMichelle California
    edited September 2018
    Kim had clearly been feeling the separation/divide between she and Jimmy, and their relationship on the verge of ending.  Maybe she thinks that her excitement at pulling off scams with Jimmy and seeing how that brought them back together, is the key to saving their relationship which is why she wants to do it again?  Maybe she thinks it's somehow easier than breaking up with him?  I mean it sounds ridiculous but apparently, it's not like she's above it.  I agree with ARon that it's also more exciting than reading 'dusty law books' (booorrrrriinnnggggg).
    Deejohnnytruant
  • Natter CastNatter Cast San Francisco, CA
    Now all they have to do is rob the Post Office of their CCTV surveillance footage and the plan will be perfect! Oh, except for Jimmy's DNA all over the letters. And the dozen witnesses on the bus. And the fact that all the phone numbers are burners and Huell was arrested for defending a guy selling burners. Whose DNA is all over the letters.

    But aside from that, it's the perfect plan!
    Murderbear
  • Now all they have to do is rob the Post Office of their CCTV surveillance footage and the plan will be perfect! Oh, except for Jimmy's DNA all over the letters. And the dozen witnesses on the bus. And the fact that all the phone numbers are burners and Huell was arrested for defending a guy selling burners. Whose DNA is all over the letters.

    But aside from that, it's the perfect plan!
    Except there is no way the ABQ DA is going to go to any of that trouble for a minor crime.  They are barely willing to go through that for a murder.
    Murderbear
  • Michelle said:
    Kim had clearly been feeling the separation/divide between she and Jimmy, and their relationship on the verge of ending.  Maybe she thinks that her excitement at pulling off scams with Jimmy and seeing how that brought them back together, is the key to saving their relationship which is why she wants to do it again?  Maybe she thinks it's somehow easier than breaking up with him?  I mean it sounds ridiculous but apparently, it's not like she's above it.  I agree with ARon that it's also more exciting than reading 'dusty law books' (booorrrrriinnnggggg).
    This is kind of what I was thinking. I don't really buy the take that she "caught the scamming bug."  I think she enjoyed doing the scams in that she enjoyed the company of Jimmy. She doesn't seem all that dissatisfied with her professional life, the montages are showing that relationship fall apart.

    Just because you can put most of the blame on Jimmy, doesn't mean that she doesn't have agency in the relationship and wouldn't want to try to repair it. People can act stupidly in relationships, maybe more so when they're ending, and it's not that ridiculous that she would act out in a stupid way to try to save something she once loved. But, it will likely blow up in her face.
    Michelle
  • HatorianHatorian Dagobah
    edited September 2018
    Pretty sure this huell plan is going to backfire. 

    Were going to get a scene where they probably match up handwriting, sort of like B.B. WW. 

    And that will probably break Kim 
  • Garthgou81Garthgou81 Placerville, CA
    I haven't gotten to the longer cast yet. But I think the Villigang have been doing some subtle things to show the rut that Kim/Jimmy are in. Jimmy is consistently making orange juice and trying to figure out dinner, Kim is toiling away at her banking job before then starting pro bono work as a public defender. Then that opening split-screen sequence last week, I fully believe the gang was leading up to this by showing both Kim and Jimmy acting out in their own ways.

    And once Kim got a taste of doing something crazy like that it sparked excitement in her. One that she could share with Jimmy and also combine her lawyering. Aron mentioned it like the reaction to an addiction. That's exactly what we saw here, Kim finally realizing the drug that gets her high as a kite. Add in that she is probably hoping that this will save her relationship with Jimmy, and it totally makes sense.

    There is a bit of dirty water in that we were purposefully misdirected into thinking she was done with Jimmy when really she was just in need of finding her own way to be Slipping Kimmy. 
    Michelle
  • Doctor_NickDoctor_Nick Terminus
    edited September 2018
    Why didn't Mike take the Germans out of town for R&R if there was such concern for loose lips sinking Superlabs and Germans being obvious? 
    tom_gdjcaudle01
  • I haven't gotten to the longer cast yet. But I think the Villigang have been doing some subtle things to show the rut that Kim/Jimmy are in. Jimmy is consistently making orange juice and trying to figure out dinner, Kim is toiling away at her banking job before then starting pro bono work as a public defender. Then that opening split-screen sequence last week, I fully believe the gang was leading up to this by showing both Kim and Jimmy acting out in their own ways.

    And once Kim got a taste of doing something crazy like that it sparked excitement in her. One that she could share with Jimmy and also combine her lawyering. Aron mentioned it like the reaction to an addiction. That's exactly what we saw here, Kim finally realizing the drug that gets her high as a kite. Add in that she is probably hoping that this will save her relationship with Jimmy, and it totally makes sense.

    There is a bit of dirty water in that we were purposefully misdirected into thinking she was done with Jimmy when really she was just in need of finding her own way to be Slipping Kimmy. 
    I can’t remeber fully, but wasn’t Kim the one that wanted to continue the Tequila con in earlier seasons?for whatever reason, I’m not so sure the “con” game is so far off from Kim’s moral compass. 
  • I watched Coushatta last night and just had to get this off my chest.  That was one of the WORST episodes of TV I've seen in a while and all the more disappointing considering how much I adore the show.  I haven't had a chance to listen to the podcasts yet, and only browsed through these posts.
    First - There's simply no way that boring sequence about the letter writing campaign is so special.  I'm sure lawyers have thought of this before.  It order for something to be a 'scam' it has to have high stakes.  There aren't any here.  At all. 
    Second - While I get that Kim is unfulfilled in her life and relationship and that she's looking for something to get her juices flowing, I don't think this 'scam' is the thing that we can say actually does that.  She's feeling lonely in the relationship and needs something to give her a reason to stay with Jimmy so I can see that the writers needed something.  But this something isn't that type of something.
    Third - There's no way in hell a guy like the German would EVER make the error of discussing his work in a bar with strangers.  He's too precise.  I don't buy it.
    Ugh.
  • Why didn't Mike take the Germans out of town for R&R if there was such concern for loose lips sinking Superlabs and Germans being obvious? 
    One does not date two people at the same time that are closer than 75 miles from each other.  Sometimes distance is a good thing.
  • Okay, just finished the full podcast 30 minutes ago, and I've already forgotten the German word for the 2nd hand cringe inducing discomfort feeling.  I probably need to see it spelled out anyway.  Please help!

    (LOL on looking for the German word for encountering the same new word twice in 24 hours)
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