Non-Political News Thread

HatorianHatorian Dagobah
edited February 23 in General
wanted to create a thread for news items to be discussed that is non political. When I say non political I mean directly involving the government. Obviously most topics have at least some politics involved. 

So I’ll start it off. YouTube announced that it’s going to stop recommending flat-earth and other “borderline” videos To viewers to stop the spread of misinformation.

https://www.npr.org/2019/01/28/689473801/youtube-to-stop-promoting-videos-that-spread-misinformation

Im definitely a round-earther but this concerns me. YouTube is now in a sense filtering what is recommended to people. While most people will believe 9/11, moon landings and other conspiracies are bogus I don’t agree that YouTube or any website should be burying these types of videos as it will dangerously get to a place where when do draw the line? This has the potential to bury real videos that raise real questions on Certain topics. We have a duty and right to challenge what we are told. But it is not the duty of private entities to limit what we see. I mean if YouTube was around in the 70s would they have buried videos that were exposing MKultra? I mean it was a conspiracy at one point. 

Who at youtube has the power to say what is real and what is fake? I know these videos are not being deleted just harder to access. But I just find it scary that we are now getting to a point where people are now semi-censoring what people see. It’s a dangerous slope and I don’t like the way it can go. It can only get worse. 





djcaudle01Landscraping
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Comments

  • They’re going to stop promoting them in their “watch this next” algorithm which isn’t the same as censoring them though I recognize these actions are on the same spectrum.

    You can look at it from the perspective of: Why is Google/YouTube is promoting fake conspiracy theories over actual information? They should stop doing that.

    I don’t dabble in these things at all, but I have been fed to videos about the end of the world as told by the constellations and the secret death planet Nibru, etc. There really is something up with the algorithm that they need to look at. Maybe these videos generate a lot of comments or something and are so promoted more than other videos, which may also be causing the latest child predator controversy with YouTube?
    Alkaid13Dee
  • Alkaid13Alkaid13 Georgia
    edited February 22
    I’m fine with people deplatforming conspiracy theories because that shit is dangerous. If people are actually dumb enough to believe the shit that assholes like Alex Jones says (and there are a surprising number of people who watch that nutcase) maybe we do need a little censorship because some people are going fucking crazy with this shit. The current YT algorithm tries to get me to watch right wing conspiracy nut vids almost daily despite being basically as opposite as one could be from the intended audience for those so obviously it needs some fixing. If the YouTube corporate overlords start censoring actual facts in order to promote their global world domination agenda or whatever then I’ll get in the streets and protest them with everyone else but until then this seems both benign and potentially helpful. YouTube has its share of issues but differentiating between obvious conspiracy theory nonsense like flat earth or anti-vaxxers and regular vids seems like a very clear cut case to me. 
    Kate23DeeDoubleA_Ron
  • In related news: Pinterest is blocking search results for vaccination to try to stop the spread of a lot of misinformation (putting it mildly) related to vaccines. The Anti-Vax stuff has gone from a few nut jobs to a public health crisis in some areas.

    I also support them doing something, though I’d argue that the search should just go to pages from the WHO and NIH rather than being blocked entirely at least this is better than nothing.

    Only downside is that it feeds into the conspiracy of the instruments of the Illuminati or Deep State or whatever suppressing the truth, but any action can be interpreted to validate a conspiracy theory so you can’t tailor actions based on the response of true-believers.
  • tom_gtom_g WV
    edited February 22
    Does Robert Kraft being charged for solicitation belong in this thread, the politics thread, or the NFL thread?
  • Alkaid13Alkaid13 Georgia
    edited February 22
    It’s not really a political question, it would be an NFL question if you’re discussing how it will affect football, it would be a news question if you’re more interested in discussing whether prostitution should be legal or whatnot. 
    TravisNoel
  • Yeah, he's a businessman who wields political power because he's all rich and stuff, but I think to try to disqualify it as a political story would be quite a stretch (assuming there are no actual political stuff going on with it, I'm just hearing about this now).
  • The news raises the issue of sex slavery - and - I hate the Patriots.  I guess it belongs in this thread.
    TravisJovial_Falcon
  • Over the last few months I've taken a really deep dive into the flat-earth world on youtube and I have to say that I fully support their decision to stop promoting flat-earth videos.  We can worry about slippery-slops when we see them happening, but right now the damage being done by the flat-earth movement can't be ignored.

    Flat-earth isn't just about believing that the earth is flat, it's about all of the mental and 'logical' steps that it takes to get to believing that the earth is flat.  First, you have to stop believing in science.  They preach about how they're "true scientists" and are just challening the orthedoxy of the "faith based religion of science".  What that means is that gravity is fake, NASA (and every other space agency in the world) is fake, there's a global conspiracy to hide the truth, which means the news and information in general is fake etc.  Embracing all of that has implications that go way beyond simplying believing that the earth is flat.  It means that vacinations are poison designed to keep you sick, it means Sandy Hook was faked to keep you scared, it means that climate change is a hoax etc.  Believing those things have real world consequences. 

    In the flat earth documentary, Mark Sargent (one of the leaders of the movement) tells the story of kids breaking out in laughter at a science teacher when she mentions the globe.  In a country that is falling behind in math and science, embracing ignorance is a real world problem and not just a nutty idea in some youtube videos.

    Once you doubt everything, anything is possible.  There's a related movement to flat-earth called Breatharianism.  These people reject science to the point where they believe that they can live on air alone and don't need food or water.  At least one woman has died (in Switzerland) and many others have been hospitalized.

    And not to make this political, but all of these people - literally every single one of them that I've encountered (100+) - are all Trump supporters.  Not because they like tax cuts or want to see a wall built, but rather because behind the scenes Trump is fighting a heroic fight against a Washington pedophile ring and that any day now Hillary Clinton is going to get arrested for being the ring leader.  They don't care about Trump's politics, they love that he's the conspiracy theory President who exposed that Obama was a muslim, that elections are fake, that climate change science is fake etc.

    My only concern about youtube's decision to stop promoting this garbage is how it might affect the amazing science community that has sprung up on youtube to fight all of the flat earth nonsense.  If you're interested in any of this, check out Scimandan, Conspiracy Catz, Fight the Flat Earth, Soundly, McToon, Godless Engineer, Team Skeptic, Young Blue Skeptic (a 15 year old kid who's smarter than every flat earther!), Bob the Science Guy, Reds Rhetoric, The Creeky Blinder, Wolfie6020 and some of the debates hosted by The NonSequitur Show.

    gguenotUnderwoodDee
  • We're (U.S.) already well behind. 
    Also, Giuliani is trump's cybersecurity advisor. 
  • Over the last few months I've taken a really deep dive into the flat-earth world on youtube and I have to say that I fully support their decision to stop promoting flat-earth videos.  We can worry about slippery-slops when we see them happening, but right now the damage being done by the flat-earth movement can't be ignored.

    Flat-earth isn't just about believing that the earth is flat, it's about all of the mental and 'logical' steps that it takes to get to believing that the earth is flat.  First, you have to stop believing in science.  They preach about how they're "true scientists" and are just challening the orthedoxy of the "faith based religion of science".  What that means is that gravity is fake, NASA (and every other space agency in the world) is fake, there's a global conspiracy to hide the truth, which means the news and information in general is fake etc.  Embracing all of that has implications that go way beyond simplying believing that the earth is flat.  It means that vacinations are poison designed to keep you sick, it means Sandy Hook was faked to keep you scared, it means that climate change is a hoax etc.  Believing those things have real world consequences. 

    In the flat earth documentary, Mark Sargent (one of the leaders of the movement) tells the story of kids breaking out in laughter at a science teacher when she mentions the globe.  In a country that is falling behind in math and science, embracing ignorance is a real world problem and not just a nutty idea in some youtube videos.

    Once you doubt everything, anything is possible.  There's a related movement to flat-earth called Breatharianism.  These people reject science to the point where they believe that they can live on air alone and don't need food or water.  At least one woman has died (in Switzerland) and many others have been hospitalized.

    And not to make this political, but all of these people - literally every single one of them that I've encountered (100+) - are all Trump supporters.  Not because they like tax cuts or want to see a wall built, but rather because behind the scenes Trump is fighting a heroic fight against a Washington pedophile ring and that any day now Hillary Clinton is going to get arrested for being the ring leader.  They don't care about Trump's politics, they love that he's the conspiracy theory President who exposed that Obama was a muslim, that elections are fake, that climate change science is fake etc.

    My only concern about youtube's decision to stop promoting this garbage is how it might affect the amazing science community that has sprung up on youtube to fight all of the flat earth nonsense.  If you're interested in any of this, check out Scimandan, Conspiracy Catz, Fight the Flat Earth, Soundly, McToon, Godless Engineer, Team Skeptic, Young Blue Skeptic (a 15 year old kid who's smarter than every flat earther!), Bob the Science Guy, Reds Rhetoric, The Creeky Blinder, Wolfie6020 and some of the debates hosted by The NonSequitur Show.

    I’m not going to bother to look for it so I’m hoping you can just answer with a quick ‘hot take’ for me. How do they explain the moon which you can clearly see with the naked eye that it is round and with a telescope I’m guessing you can tell that it’s spherical?  Or is it just the Earth is flat? Lol. I really can’t believe this is a thing. 
  • Alkaid13Alkaid13 Georgia
    edited February 22
    I mean you can see the spherical curvature of the earth with the naked eye too from certain points, but that doesn’t dissuade people I guess. I assume they trust their fake science more than their own observations. 
  • CretanBullCretanBull Toronto
    edited February 22
    Over the last few months I've taken a really deep dive into the flat-earth world on youtube and I have to say that I fully support their decision to stop promoting flat-earth videos.  We can worry about slippery-slops when we see them happening, but right now the damage being done by the flat-earth movement can't be ignored.

    Flat-earth isn't just about believing that the earth is flat, it's about all of the mental and 'logical' steps that it takes to get to believing that the earth is flat.  First, you have to stop believing in science.  They preach about how they're "true scientists" and are just challening the orthedoxy of the "faith based religion of science".  What that means is that gravity is fake, NASA (and every other space agency in the world) is fake, there's a global conspiracy to hide the truth, which means the news and information in general is fake etc.  Embracing all of that has implications that go way beyond simplying believing that the earth is flat.  It means that vacinations are poison designed to keep you sick, it means Sandy Hook was faked to keep you scared, it means that climate change is a hoax etc.  Believing those things have real world consequences. 

    In the flat earth documentary, Mark Sargent (one of the leaders of the movement) tells the story of kids breaking out in laughter at a science teacher when she mentions the globe.  In a country that is falling behind in math and science, embracing ignorance is a real world problem and not just a nutty idea in some youtube videos.

    Once you doubt everything, anything is possible.  There's a related movement to flat-earth called Breatharianism.  These people reject science to the point where they believe that they can live on air alone and don't need food or water.  At least one woman has died (in Switzerland) and many others have been hospitalized.

    And not to make this political, but all of these people - literally every single one of them that I've encountered (100+) - are all Trump supporters.  Not because they like tax cuts or want to see a wall built, but rather because behind the scenes Trump is fighting a heroic fight against a Washington pedophile ring and that any day now Hillary Clinton is going to get arrested for being the ring leader.  They don't care about Trump's politics, they love that he's the conspiracy theory President who exposed that Obama was a muslim, that elections are fake, that climate change science is fake etc.

    My only concern about youtube's decision to stop promoting this garbage is how it might affect the amazing science community that has sprung up on youtube to fight all of the flat earth nonsense.  If you're interested in any of this, check out Scimandan, Conspiracy Catz, Fight the Flat Earth, Soundly, McToon, Godless Engineer, Team Skeptic, Young Blue Skeptic (a 15 year old kid who's smarter than every flat earther!), Bob the Science Guy, Reds Rhetoric, The Creeky Blinder, Wolfie6020 and some of the debates hosted by The NonSequitur Show.

    I’m not going to bother to look for it so I’m hoping you can just answer with a quick ‘hot take’ for me. How do they explain the moon which you can clearly see with the naked eye that it is round and with a telescope I’m guessing you can tell that it’s spherical?  Or is it just the Earth is flat? Lol. I really can’t believe this is a thing. 
    This is their standard argument:  "You've had thousands of years to develop the globe-earth theory, we've only had a hundred years to develop the flat-earth theory so we don't have all of the answers.  At this point, all we can do is prove that the earth is flat."

    When it comes to the moon (and sun for that matter), there isn't a consensus view but the most common one is that the moon and sun are both small and local (ie the moon isn't 240 odd thousnad miles away and the sun isn't 93 million miles away)...and then they argue about what they are.  Some believe that the earth is under a giant dome (the "fermament" mentioned in the bible) and the moon and stars are just projections on to the inside of the dome.  Other believe that the moon emits its own light and I've seen phoney 'experiments' with a laser thermometer that 'measures' the 'cold light' emitted from the moon.
    Landscraping
  • edited February 22
    Well I went and looked. One theory is that the 
    moon is a hologram. Another states that the sun and moon are attached to a giant rotating lid or something. There’re others but I’ve seen enough...
  • In a less dumb world, “All we can do is prove that the earth is flat” should be the beginning and end of those arguments because you can’t prove a falsehood. 
    CretanBullLandscraping
  • Over the last few months I've taken a really deep dive into the flat-earth world on youtube and I have to say that I fully support their decision to stop promoting flat-earth videos.  We can worry about slippery-slops when we see them happening, but right now the damage being done by the flat-earth movement can't be ignored.

    Flat-earth isn't just about believing that the earth is flat, it's about all of the mental and 'logical' steps that it takes to get to believing that the earth is flat.  First, you have to stop believing in science.  They preach about how they're "true scientists" and are just challening the orthedoxy of the "faith based religion of science".  What that means is that gravity is fake, NASA (and every other space agency in the world) is fake, there's a global conspiracy to hide the truth, which means the news and information in general is fake etc.  Embracing all of that has implications that go way beyond simplying believing that the earth is flat.  It means that vacinations are poison designed to keep you sick, it means Sandy Hook was faked to keep you scared, it means that climate change is a hoax etc.  Believing those things have real world consequences. 

    In the flat earth documentary, Mark Sargent (one of the leaders of the movement) tells the story of kids breaking out in laughter at a science teacher when she mentions the globe.  In a country that is falling behind in math and science, embracing ignorance is a real world problem and not just a nutty idea in some youtube videos.

    Once you doubt everything, anything is possible.  There's a related movement to flat-earth called Breatharianism.  These people reject science to the point where they believe that they can live on air alone and don't need food or water.  At least one woman has died (in Switzerland) and many others have been hospitalized.

    And not to make this political, but all of these people - literally every single one of them that I've encountered (100+) - are all Trump supporters.  Not because they like tax cuts or want to see a wall built, but rather because behind the scenes Trump is fighting a heroic fight against a Washington pedophile ring and that any day now Hillary Clinton is going to get arrested for being the ring leader.  They don't care about Trump's politics, they love that he's the conspiracy theory President who exposed that Obama was a muslim, that elections are fake, that climate change science is fake etc.

    My only concern about youtube's decision to stop promoting this garbage is how it might affect the amazing science community that has sprung up on youtube to fight all of the flat earth nonsense.  If you're interested in any of this, check out Scimandan, Conspiracy Catz, Fight the Flat Earth, Soundly, McToon, Godless Engineer, Team Skeptic, Young Blue Skeptic (a 15 year old kid who's smarter than every flat earther!), Bob the Science Guy, Reds Rhetoric, The Creeky Blinder, Wolfie6020 and some of the debates hosted by The NonSequitur Show.

    I’m not going to bother to look for it so I’m hoping you can just answer with a quick ‘hot take’ for me. How do they explain the moon which you can clearly see with the naked eye that it is round and with a telescope I’m guessing you can tell that it’s spherical?  Or is it just the Earth is flat? Lol. I really can’t believe this is a thing. 
    This is their standard argument:  "You've had thousands of years to develop the globe-earth theory, we've only had a hundred years to develop the flat-earth theory so we don't have all of the answers.  At this point, all we can do is prove that the earth is flat."

    When it comes to the moon (and sun for that matter), there isn't a consensus view but the most common one is that the moon and sun are both small and local (ie the moon isn't 240 odd thousnad miles away and the sun isn't 93 million miles away)...and then they argue about what they are.  Some believe that the earth is under a giant dome (the "fermamen" mentioned in the bible) and the moon and starts are just projections on to the inside of the dome.  Other believe that the moon emits its own light and I've seen phoney 'experiments' with a laser thermometer that 'measures' the 'cold light' emitted from the moon.
    Thank you
    CretanBull
  • I have 0 issue with YouTube stopping the promotion of flat earth and antivax videos. 
    DeecdriveDoubleA_RonCeciliaM
  • Alkaid13 said:
    I mean you can see the spherical curvature of the earth with the naked eye too from certain points, but that doesn’t dissuade people I guess. I assume they trust their fake science more than their own observations. 
    Curvature itself can't be seen from earth, but the effects of curvature are everywhere.  Over two thousand years ago, a guy named Eratosthenes (he was the librarian at the Library of Alexandria in Egypt) proved curvature by comparing the shadows cast at the bottom of two wells that were hundreds of miles apart - one in the North, the other in the South.  If the earth was flat, the sun's rays would be parallel and shadows would be the same (at the same time of day) in every well in the world.  But he noticed that the shadows were different.  Using geometry, he calculated the curvature and from that calculated the circumference of the earth.  He also figured out that the earth was on a tilted axis and that the sun was 93 million miles away.  Flat earthers are arguing against something that a dude figured out on his own in the earliest days of geometry, without the benefit of computers, calculators etc.

    This experiment can be replicated by sticking a rod or pole in the ground in two different locations one in the north, one in the south (the further away from each other the better) and measuring the shadows at noon.

    We can also watch ships set sail into the ocean and watch them disappear from the bottom-up as they sail over the horizon etc.

    Also, living in Toronto doing cross-border shopping is pretty common - in NY (near Buffalo) there are tons of outlet malls close to the Canadian border.  One of the things that we can do when we're down there is head over to a beach (I forget its name off hand) that's on the NY side of Lake Ontario.  On a clear day, we can look across the lake and see Toronto...but not all of it, the bottom part of Toronto's skyscrapers & the CN Tower are obscured by the earth's curvature.


    gguenotFlukes
  • FlukesFlukes Calgary, Canada
    Oh No Ross and Carrie did a series of podcast episodes about Flat Earth back in 2017 that included an interview with Mark Sargent.

    http://ohnopodcast.com/investigations/2017/11/30/ross-and-carrie-traverse-flat-earth-part-5-the-mark-sargent-interview

    I learned something I wasn't expecting: there are ties between Flat Earth and Christianity. 
  • Alkaid13Alkaid13 Georgia
    edited February 22
    Well of course there is, extremist Christians (and probably religious people generally but here it’s mostly Christians) are mostly responsible for the people who don’t believe dinosaurs ever existed and probably make up most of the anti-vaxer crowd too. The vast majority of the anti-science Pro-conspiracy crowd I’ve met in real life have been “Christians” who hold up the Bible like it’s literal fact “well the Bible doesn’t say we came from monkeys so obviously evolution doesn’t exist” is a tried and true argument I’ve heard. 
    CretanBull
  • tom_gtom_g WV
    edited February 22
    Were non-christians the first to apply the scientific method to prove the curvature of the earth.
  • Also I’d like to say there are definitely a lot of super smart, super scientific Christians (and other religious people) throughout history so my previous comment is not a blanket statement condemning the faithful as a bunch of rubes just my personal experience.
  • Alkaid13Alkaid13 Georgia
    edited February 22
    As far a proving the earth is round I believe that happened several centuries before Christianity became a thing. Erastothenes definitely was alive and dead before then. 
    CretanBull
  • Flukes said:
    I learned something I wasn't expecting: there are ties between Flat Earth and Christianity. 
    There are massive cross overs.  There's a prominent flat-earther from Northern Ontario (Thunder Bay maybe?) whose name I forget off hand, but he's a mega Christian, he calls the Bible a 'flat earth document' and he's repeatedly said that if the earth is ever proven to be a globe, then he's disavowing Christianity.

    There are a couple of well-known flat-earthers named Nathan and I always get them confused, I think the one that I'm referring to here is named Nathan Thompson (he's the guy who recorded himself confronting a NASA employee in a Starbucks in a viral video).  He runs the main Facebook flat-earth group (it's got something like 50,000 subscribers!) and all of his flat-earth 'proofs' are biblical.


  • There's a documentary on Netflix now called "Behind the Curve", it's pretty interesting.  During my youtube flat-earth rabbit hole I've come to despise some of these people and the damage that they're doing, but the movie is very kind to them and humanizes them in a way that's reminded me that these people are something more than their (dumb!) beliefs.

    Flukes
  • CretanBullCretanBull Toronto
    edited February 22
    Alkaid13 said:
    That's amazing, but c'mon that's a gimme-gold for America!

    I'll predict Gold for America and Silver for Japan right now.
  • I imagine that a lot of flat earthers have some legitimate mental difficiencies or are highly susceptible to being taken advantage of so I kind of feel bad for those people. I don’t really feel bad for the like big name members with 10’s or 100’s of thosudands of followers because they’re doing some real harm to world and some of them seem like they know it’s bullshit but preach it anyways just to be popular. 
  • I have zero patience for anti-vaxxers though. Trying to reintroduce the goddamn plague or something with their nonsense. They can all go fuck themselves. 
    CretanBullcdrive
  • Alkaid13 said:
    I have zero patience for anti-vaxxers though. Trying to reintroduce the goddamn plague or something with their nonsense. They can all go fuck themselves. 
    I dunno. I blew out my back a couple weeks ago and had to spend better part of a week in bed and unfortunately got sucked into YouTube and social media. After going thru comments on both I say bring the Plague on! 
    Flukes
  • Alkaid13 said:
    I have zero patience for anti-vaxxers though. Trying to reintroduce the goddamn plague or something with their nonsense. They can all go fuck themselves. 
    People are getting seriously sick and dying because of their nonsense.  Measle outbreaks are happening all over the place now, and people who rely on herd-immunity are paying the price for something that they can't control
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