805 - The Bells

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Comments

  • Prediction: next week's ep will be called "The Mad Queen," and that's why they've been so careful to keep the titles under wraps this season.
    Elisabbord
  • DeeDee Adelaide
    What I learned today is that men in this world will just turn into complete dumb fucks and/or savages if they have feels for a woman. Grey Worm turning into a murderous rampager because his lady friend got the chop, Useless bloody Jon too stupid to use his pea brain and listen to Varys because he wants to keep sticking his weiner into crazy arsehole Dany, and Jaimie spending 8 seasons redeeming himself AND get a nice new girlfriend who shares his interests, only to just go “Nah” at the end and head back to Cersei. The only smart ones were Tyrion, Davos, and Varys, none of whom have lady love interests so could actually focus on the shit they were meant to be doing. 

    I can’t believe no one got to literally murder Cersei. That was such a dud ending for one of the worst, most consistent villains of the show. 
    ken halemtron32weeniegirlGiovanni
  • Prediction: next week's ep will be called "The Mad Queen," and that's why they've been so careful to keep the titles under wraps this season.
    It's gotta be "A Dream of Spring" right? Maybe I haven't been paying attention.
    CapeGabeCeciliaMElisagjames80
  • mtron32mtron32 San Diego
    Dee said:
    What I learned today is that men in this world will just turn into complete dumb fucks and/or savages if they have feels for a woman. Grey Worm turning into a murderous rampager because his lady friend got the chop, Useless bloody Jon too stupid to use his pea brain and listen to Varys because he wants to keep sticking his weiner into crazy arsehole Dany, and Jaimie spending 8 seasons redeeming himself AND get a nice new girlfriend who shares his interests, only to just go “Nah” at the end and head back to Cersei. The only smart ones were Tyrion, Davos, and Varys, none of whom have lady love interests so could actually focus on the shit they were meant to be doing. 

    I can’t believe no one got to literally murder Cersei. That was such a dud ending for one of the worst, most consistent villains of the show. 
    Agree with everything you wrote here.  I watch Little Finger's death on repeat once every few months, that was fantastic.  Cersei's death was extremely underwhelming and unfit for a villain that good.
    Dee
  • Also im not here to be a negative piler.

    Actually i was hoping to find something to help me be ok with this ep, and by extension this season.

    Like did we get enough? From ep1 till now do ppl really feel like some of the major arcs came 100% to completion?

    Isnt this show and thus this fandom about every detail and thread and im wondering is there something i missed?

    Danny is easily the most complete line atm. 
    But i feel like we went from 2000 thread cpunt stories to 300 thread count used hotel linens real fast.


    Ill take one of the largly solid parts of this ep.
    Clegain bowl. Pretty good. 

    Lets try a comparrison.. the fight with oberyn and the mountain... better or worse than the clegain bowl?

    Imo oberyn v mountain was alot better and it shouldnt have been.

    This fight, was it ep 804 worthy? Really? Second to last ep worthy?  Even if it was, how does the rest of the plot compare?

    Is it ok that the hound v the mountain ends up being the most complete plot line of the series?

    ken haleElisa
  • DeeDee Adelaide
    Jesus guys, settle down with the sniping at each other. It’s a fucking TV show. 

    Have your differing opinions, but be civil. 
    tpelzyDoubleA_RonCapeGabejohnnytruantmajjam0770BloodyTacoMichaelGgjames80DaveyMac
  • tpelzytpelzy Dallas
    ken hale said:
    Tyrion had asked Davos if he could smuggle something.  Was that meant to be Jamie or did I miss the follow-up to that line of dialog?  If the former, anyone want to take bets on whether Davos dies by fire or getting his head bit off? 
    Thie order of events was confusing. I think Davos smuggled the boat for Jaime past the Iron Fleet. Cause he's a boat guy lol. 
    CapeGabeken hale
  • AnominalAnominal San Francisco Bay Area
    edited May 13
    I haven't read the comments yet. Here's my take.

    THE GOOD

    The beginning was mostly good. The warnings and pleading to Dany was good. Dany understanding the trail of how the word got to Varys was good.

    The cinematography and sense of space was good. This is some of the stuff I wanted from the battle at Winterfell. I felt like I had a pretty good idea of where people were. There were a lot of good transitions like the Dragon crumbling a tower of the Red Keep and then the debris falling to where Jaime and Euron were. The sense was space was much better. (The one weird thing with the cinematography was cutting back and forth between Arya and the Hound. I just didn't understand what they were saying with that.)

    The progression of the battle was clear. Sea battle, outside the walls, the win conditions, the decision by Dany to reject surrender, the progression of how ouch of the city was burning, how chaotic and then quiet the streets were, the amount of dust. There was no sense of fake outs and reversing time like with the battle of Winterfell. When it went pure chaos, it was clear it was meant to be chaos, but there was still something going on. Destinations to head to, and personal stories to follow

    THE OKAY

    Mountain killing Qyburn, Hound telling Arya to turn back. Arya and Jon for the most part. Tyrion for the most part. Davos a complete neutral neither good nor bad. Dany... In a way. If there was either one of two changes made, I would have been okay with what happened.

    THE MEH

    Cleganebowl. I called this at least two seasons ago if not longer. I didn't feel like there was going to be a satisfying Cleganebowl because the Mountain was shown to be an unthinking zombie. There's no more emotion in it. What kind of revenge is there when he's already dead?

    I came around thinking it could happen if there were other stakes involved. If The Mountain was seen as just the physical representation of Cersei's will. You have to get through The Mountain to get to her. After last episode with him doing to beheading of Missandei, I thought if I was writing this episode, it would have been perfect to show off The Mountain's power by everyone seeking revenge against him to go at him one by one. Grey Worm confronts him and dies. Arya tries to take him off her list and she is almost killed, and just like in season one with Loras, The Hound comes in and saves Arya and this time finishes the job. The emotion of the scene has transitioned from The Hound's need to get revenge against his brother to instead his need to protect Arya.

    But also from last episode and how they handled Bron, I very much expected them to go as straightforward as possible. (Same reason I wasn't disappointed that Jaime really came back to be with Cersei. That's the straightforward take the scene, no subtetly needed.) So straightforward it is. No goals, no distractions, no emotion. Just Hound vs Mountain. Check that off the list.

    THE COMICALLY BAD, BUT ALMOST GOOD

    I have no doubts that a lot of people have brought up the point asking what/why/how Dany decided to not accept surrender and just destroy everything. I was laughing throughout the episode because of this. It was shot well. Great sound, good effects, the attacks could be felt in every scene, and the Drgon is fearsome.

    How was it almost good? They set up so well last episode that Cersei was planning on using the people as human shields. They set up people being locked outside of the gate (to the Red Keep)? They set up a perfect reason to kill the townsfolk, and it wasn't used. I was expecting walls of townsfolk set up inbetween soldiers and Dany's army. I would have been fully on board with Dany burning fifty townsfolk to get ten of Cersei's soldiers. One soldier. I was ready for Dany to take out every military target regardless of the loss of civilian life or even her own soldiers. But instead we got indiscriminant slaughter just for slaughter's sake with no particular goal in mind. Will Dany even ever sit on the literal Iron Throne? Or is it buried in rubble now?

    Also last episode thread I was already starting to wonder if maybe Cersei would be a good ruler if the Seven Kingdom's were at peace. I think she would have been pretty okay at it (with the exception of needing to keep from getting assassinated by Euron after a boy is born.) I did feel sorry for her this whole episode after Dany flipped her crazy switch.

    THE EYE-ROLLING INSERT

    Random insert townsfolk shown prominently multiple times so Arya could save and then fail to save that person. They did not need to introduce this kind of one and done storyline into the episode.

    THE MISSING

    I'm actually a little surprised we didn't get any Yara this episode. We saw her in the first episode and she's been mentioned in the previous two episodes. I was expecting her to have shipped Jon and his men down to the battlefield and/or engage with Euron's fleet.

    Tryion tells Davos about the back entrance so he puts the boat there and comes back? First, Tyrion knows a secret entrance! He should have told everyone that and that should have been incorporated into the plan but maybe he was dumb and wanted a way out for Jaime. But he told Davos! Davos should have told everyone else about its existence, but stupidly maybe everyone only thinks of it as an exit, except even the stupidest Lannister uses it as his alternate entrance! 

    FINALE?

    If we're going as straightforward as possible with the finale from what they've set up. Dany dies, probably Jon too. Sansa takes the Iron Throne maybe with Tyrion as her Hand or husband. 



    OldGriswold
  • edited May 13
    mtron32 said:
    The only way that they could have made it better if if Dany had attacked the Iron Fleet and walls during the night before.

    Seeing Drogon using his black coloring to do a night raid dropping out of the black sky would have been awesome. And there would have been enough light from the city, toches and dragon fire to light the episode well enough that I dont have to suffer through complaints about the episode lighting.

    Anyways, I dont want to rewrite an episode for them because I get how not knowing what was going to happen on the day of the battle added more tension. And of course, if Dany did that, then she could have easily finished off the Golden Company that night and taken the city. So it adds a problem with the whole plot.

    That hadn't occured to me till you said it but why the hell didn't she just attack at night, visibility would be horrid.

    No more fucking night scenes please! I for one was happy to see a well lit battle. Even if it makes thematic sense my 4K TV would have been smashed tonight if it was a night episode.
    telephoneofmadness
  • tonyp1222tonyp1222 new york
    edited May 13
    I saw a suggestion on Reddit that would've been awesome.

    What if D&D misinterpreted GRRM's notes. What if Dany, at the moment of surrender, guns it for the Red Keep and lights it up, but in doing so triggers all of the wildfire under the city setup by her father -- inadvertantly "burning them all."

    If she only went for the Red Keep out of vengeance on Cersei and accidentally wiped the city with the cache of her father’s wild fire, accidentally becoming The Mad Queen in the eyes of the realm.... It also would've given reason to why we saw it here in the first place. As of now, it's sort of random.

    FUUUUUUCK THAT WOULD’VE BEEN SO MUCH BETTER! 
    ken halemajjam0770BloodyTacob.larevtelephoneofmadnessrustywright4rkcrawf
  • Also im not here to be a negative piler.

    Actually i was hoping to find something to help me be ok with this ep, and by extension this season.

    Like did we get enough? From ep1 till now do ppl really feel like some of the major arcs came 100% to completion?
    One thing I really liked was the fulfilment of Cersei's expectations during the battle of Blackwater. Can't recall exactly but I think she talks about how despite Stannis being a "good man" when a sack happens the soldier will get their blood up and lose their morals. I just wish we had even half the drunken mess of Cersei from Blackwater. She was so dynamic before and very distant in this episode.
    Elisa
  • There was a scene where Cersei was in denial and all I could think is she is acting like the Chernobyl night manager.
    ken halejohnnytruantb.larevdarwinfeeshytelephoneofmadnessrkcrawf
  • CapeGabe said:
    There was a scene where Cersei was in denial and all I could think is she is acting like the Chernobyl night manager.
    Are you suggesting a RDKP can explode?
    darwinfeeshytelephoneofmadnessrkcrawf
  • CapeGabe said:
    There was a scene where Cersei was in denial and all I could think is she is acting like the Chernobyl night manager.
    Are you suggesting a RDKP can explode?

    No, I am suggesting that a dragon could never fly all the way up here. You are delirious, go see the nurse.
    :)

    johnnytruantb.larevdarwinfeeshytelephoneofmadness
  • mtron32mtron32 San Diego
    tonyp1222 said:
    I saw a suggestion on Reddit that would've been awesome.

    What if D&D misinterpreted GRRM's notes. What if Dany, at the moment of surrender, guns it for the Red Keep and lights it up, but in doing so triggers all of the wildfire under the city setup by her father -- inadvertantly "burning them all."

    If she only went for the Red Keep out of vengeance on Cersei and accidentally wiped the city with the cache of her father’s wild fire, accidentally becoming The Mad Queen in the eyes of the realm.... It also would've given reason to why we saw it here in the first place. As of now, it's sort of random.

    FUUUUUUCK THAT WOULD’VE BEEN SO MUCH BETTER! 
    Yeah, that's a damn good idea.  Maybe Cersei had her own personal Scorpion and shot Dorogon in the tail making Khaleesei come in hard.
  • mtron32mtron32 San Diego
    CapeGabe said:
    CapeGabe said:
    There was a scene where Cersei was in denial and all I could think is she is acting like the Chernobyl night manager.
    Are you suggesting a RDKP can explode?

    No, I am suggesting that a dragon could never fly all the way up here. You are delirious, go see the nurse.
    :)

    That dude was hilarious though.  He could be bleeding out the ass still yelling "cores can't explode!!!!"
    CapeGabe
  • One more episode of GOT to go, and my disappointment arc will be complete
    budesignsken hale
  • edited May 13
    Dany and Greyworm got swept up in bloodlust and revenge (throwing Messandei’s slave collar into the fire showed his ire at her robbed freedom). Dany was sick of Westerosi political correctness (she knew her advisors were gonna pat her on the head for a quick and bloodless win, and maybe stop her from executing Cersei). I’m filling in all of the blanks (which the DD’s assume I’ll pick up on) so I can enjoy this non-book ride. Filming was stellar, Lena grasped Cersei’s desperation for Jaime from the books (when is he coming for me?), Jon’s typical Stark shock at seeing his men succumb to bloodlust was perfect...lots of good. Poor storytelling with Arya escaping, Jaime “rescuing” Cersei, and why fight Euron? 
    gjames80
  • mtron32 said:
    CapeGabe said:
    CapeGabe said:
    There was a scene where Cersei was in denial and all I could think is she is acting like the Chernobyl night manager.
    Are you suggesting a RDKP can explode?

    No, I am suggesting that a dragon could never fly all the way up here. You are delirious, go see the nurse.
    :)

    That dude was hilarious though.  He could be bleeding out the ass still yelling "cores can't explode!!!!"
    ( goes to lower dragon control rods )
    darwinfeeshybbord
  • edited May 13
    Soooooo... Arya’s dead, right?  Like none of that bit at the end with her finding the horse and riding away actually happened...?

    Cause if not, it sure as shit felt that way (to me, at least).

    Edit: I’m currently listening to the Instant Cast and absolutely loving it (and I genuinely enjoyed this episode).  

    Clearly some of y’all never watched The Walking Dead and listened to Watching Dead... there’s nothing like a good BM hate cast!
    I don't think its a dream but I do think she is dead. They just couldn't show anybody or anything kill her as people would probably say come on, she kills the NK and then gets killed that way. I've got a suspicion that the white horse is supposed to represent a spirit animal. Not that I'm anyway knowledgeable or believe these things but a google search of white horse spirit animal brings up this interesting statement. 

    "In this case, horse symbolism is letting you know that you have the power to change anything and everything you choose in your life. Moreover, understand that the wild freedom of this animal can be harnessed and used for your benefit and those around you. This understanding comes only when man and beast enter a silent contract acknowledging mutual respect and awareness of responsibility to each other.

    Alternatively, you are being asked to understand that real power is the wisdom found in remembering your journey as a whole. Furthermore, compassion, caring, teaching, loving, and sharing your gifts, talents, and abilities are the gateways to power.

    Inevitably, horse meaning advises you that all pathways have equal validity. Keeping this in mind will give you insight into the power and the glory of a unified family and humanity. Every human being must follow a pathway to empowerment before galloping upon the wings of destiny"

    https://www.spirit-animals.com/horse-symbolism/

    I think, especially the second and third paragraph could explain why they showed The Hound and her with quick edit cuts while Cleganebowl was happening. I think they both fulfilled that journey.  
  • MichaelG said:
    I liked it. 

    Its ok Jim and Aron didn’t.

    I’ll still listen bc I like Bald Move and don’t mind disagreement, even welcome it. 

    Everyone needs to relax and have a drink. 
    Fuck you! *flips table and punches nearest person*
    PeepsMichaelGvisi0nBloodyTacoCeciliaM
  • A. Ron this episode:

    Looselips33MichaelGbbordgjames80CeciliaM
  • HatorianHatorian Dagobah
    Thought I posted this already but can’t find it so sorry if this is a duplicate. Jim mentions on the instant cast that he just wanted to see 1 thing break Dany to show her turn to the mad queen but didn’t get it. 

    Id have to disagree. Pretty sure having Varys and Jon lie and backstab her while she’s now completing alone and isolated seems like enough to me for her to break in this episode. 
    BenMurderbearNimeriaLurksawookieeAaronCeciliaM
  • walktheskywalkthesky New York
    CapeGabe said:
    I don't understand the hate for Bald Move for giving their opinions, people who are disappointed in the show and just anyone who has a different opinion.

    Entertainment is subjective. We can all still be civil. I fell out with this show last season and still read people's opinion that like the show and find interesting things.

    There seems to be the opinion that this is a Game of Thrones fan club and the dissenters are trolls intruding on the show lover's safe space shitting all over the place.

    Myself I am someone who loved the first three books, meh on the last two and loved the show until GRRM screwed everyone over by falling way behind. When he forced the Double D's to write fan fiction they didn't do a good job at it and instead of hiring real writers decided to write it themselves.

    I watch the show because it is the only ending I'll ever get to see most likely.

    If I point out horrible writing and bad character development it isn't an attack on those who still love the show but on the hacks that are writing it now.

    My opinion is just as valid as anyone's and if you get bent out of shape because of something I say it is pretty sad.

    It is tiresome that so many here feel the need to attack the dissenters. I haven't seen any attacks from the dissenters saying the people who like the show should shut up and go away.

    I love all you Official Unofficials because we weren't like all the other online communities that tear themselves apart. Maybe I was wrong.
    Please don’t label the disagreement with the podcast as hateful.  Terrible words to assign to a disagreement.  It’s pretty civil on here.
    gjames80
  • Did anyone else think for a second that the Arya horse stuff was a dying scene? Probably Maisie Williams just likes horses but still kinda weird. Ignoring all the dragon  ballista buildup before this episode worked for me at least on some level, because this is what a dragon attack on a city should look like, you need a lucky shot. I agree it would have been more believable in the context of the series if the initial attack to take out the fleet and the city defenses happened at night.
    I would have liked it if the northeners were kind of onboard with the sacking as a retaliation for the red wedding. Character and plotwise I often see where they wanted to go, it's just short- or undercut in a way that doesn't feel rewarding or  makes much narrative sense anymore. It's an event show with great spectacle, no point of overanalysing it. For me that's what declaring fan bankcruptcy means, there are other great shows like the expanse coming up.



    ken hale
  • Dear Double D's
    I found your Pizza shop a few years ago and tried your tasty pie. It was like nothing I'd ever tasted before.
    I heard you had borrowed the recipe from an old man name "G. Martin" and made it your own.
    I loved the pie so much, i told friends about it and had looked forward to dining with you every year when I was back in town.
    However, about 4 years ago, I got a little sick from one of your pies. I didn't think much of it at the time as the next pie was pretty good. However, there was something not quite right (Season 4)
    The next year when I returned to your Pizza shop, it seemed as if there were new owners, the pies looked the same but were some what different. At first I couldn't tell what it was, but it seemed like a little fecal matter had been introduced to the recipe. I'd been dining at your establishment for years but this was not the same meal or feeling I had before. Maybe it was just me but I can come back again just to be sure (Season 5)
    On my next visit, there seem to be even more changes to the recipe, the pie was tasting a little worse and the good ingredients I'd use to love, were getting less and less. In fact, it also seemed as if my meal had been rushed so I couldn't see or even notice what was being served to me (Season 6 and 7)
    Now, on my most recent visit, I swear that the pie I use to love, has been completely replaced with crap! Yes, you are serving a Turd.
    What I had to endure tonight was not to a standard I or anyone should sit through. The pie was dry and and no substance. I was feeling ill halfway through but I told myself, that it couldn't be true. But by the end of tonights meal, i was truly sick. You are serving nothing but Shit to me and all your customers. 
    On the way out, I noticed your restaurant has been given notice to close and I'm glad in a way as this type of meal can no longer be served.
    A once loyal fan of your work 
    :(

    I'm sorry everyone, but the story tonight was ridiculous. 
    - 1 dragon can avoid all the cross bows
    - Tyrian is an idiot
    - Jamie and Cersie died like that

    There is so much great material there that could be slightly tweeked and the story wouldbe more awesome
    1. Jamie needed to kill Cersie
    2. Dany becomes mad queen after she finds out Tyrian released Jamie. Simple revenge against Tyrian as he wanted to save the little folk
    3. 
  • 1. Jamie needed to kill Cersie
    Season eight HBO Jaime killing his sister & love who is carrying his unborn child seems a bit extreme with no benefit to anyone. 
    awookieegjames80
  • CindyCindy Seattle
    edited May 13
    I liked the episode.

    However I hated the end of Jaime's arc. In some way I hope that's because GRRM will also end it that way because if this was a showrunner move then I think it was a poor move. Its tragic sure but I don't know. Just not pleased with it.

    I actually like the "unsatisfactory" way Cersei went out. Its very Game of Thrones for the demise of the antagonists to not go out as fitting or violently as you would expect. 

  • I don’t know how to feel about this episode. Some amazing scenes for sure.  I actually felt for Jaime. He was trying to save the love of his life, and his sister, who is a truly broken person. That felt like what people do in real life. The world is full of people in love with monsters that they can’t abandon even when it means their own destruction. As far as Dany I am thinking she was so full of rage and felt that the surrender was Cersei and her forces now asking for mercy when they would never have showed mercy to anyone. An arrow whistling past her as the bells rang out would have helped sell it a bit. I don’t blame the guys for trashing this, it’s their take and it is true to how they cover shows. I am sure they would rather be singing praises. I won’t tune out, even if they break out sombreros next week.
  • All the ChickensAll the Chickens Birmingham, AL
    Cindy said:
    I liked the episode.

    However I hated the end of Jaime's arc. In some way I hope that's because GRRM will also end it that way because if this was a showrunner move then I think it was a poor move. Its tragic sure but I don't know. Just not pleased with it.

    I actually like the "unsatisfactory" way Cersei went out. Its very Game of Thrones for the demise of the antagonists to not go out as fitting or violently as you would expect. 

    Yeah, but we can only allow Game of Thrones to act like Game of Thrones when we like the things that happen or they match our head canon.
    Flukesawookieegjames80
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