(Spoiler) Who Else HATED Stranger Things 3 ? A discussion on likes/dislikes

Ok, after finally seeing all episodes, I am so disappointed with the last season of Stranger Things. Granted, I loved the 80s nostalgia (the mall, fashions, music, cars, remembering the Cold War and our fears around that [note: not a love of mine, just reminds me of the times}).

Outside of all that nostalgia, this season had a story that was severely lacking. Here are some of the things I had problems with:
- Tropey (sp) storytelling: E.g. Hopper telling Joyce to turn the key at the count of three, and being hit at 2.  That is such an 80s movie cliche, and infuriating. 
- What happened to everyone effected by the mind flayer (Billy, the life guard, her parents, the old lady)? Did they concoct a new story about how they died? And, if so, why wasn't that part of the news clip at the very end? All that included was things from season 1 and 2 (please correct me if I am wrong).
- Is Hopper being held by Russians? This sorry attempt at an 80s cliffhanger rings hollow.
- Robin's crush on Steve. This came across as a true crush on him. She talked about how she would always watch him. The turnabout felt unnatural. Note: I still love Robin as a character (despite not fully buying into her picking up the Russian language that quickly), and I absolutely buy that Steve would be that supportive and cool after he found out about her. 
- Lack of storytelling around Lucas, Max, Will. Mike's storyline was pretty lacking too, but I'm not complaining since he is my least favorite character. Everyone else just stood around and had reaction shots to what was happening. 
- Hopper's change in character. His character traits were just off this season. As Jim mentioned in a few of the podcasts, his story just didn't add up this season. 
- Joyce was annoying. That is all.
- Nancy played the part of lots of 80s heroes. Mess up/fumble around until it's time to be heroic. It was annoying.
- Max suffering/grieving in silence at the end. What was that about? Felt unnatural. Does she not feel she can open up to her friends about what happened? Tell us more. 


These are just some of the problems I had. Am I the only one? Anyone else think it was lacking? 
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Comments

  • lengmolengmo RTP, NC
    - Tropey (sp) storytelling: E.g. Hopper telling Joyce to turn the key at the count of three, and being hit at 2.  That is such an 80s movie cliche, and infuriating. 
    - What happened to everyone effected by the mind flayer (Billy, the life guard, her parents, the old lady)? Did they concoct a new story about how they died? And, if so, why wasn't that part of the news clip at the very end? All that included was things from season 1 and 2 (please correct me if I am wrong).
    I'm pretty sure the storytelling was intentionally part of the 80s nostalgia.

    I don't remember the specific words but IIRC the deaths were explained as part of the mall destruction.

    There were certainly weak points in the show but personally I liked it much better than s2. 
    Travis
  • HatorianHatorian Dagobah
    Ok, after finally seeing all episodes, I am so disappointed with the last season of Stranger Things. Granted, I loved the 80s nostalgia (the mall, fashions, music, cars, remembering the Cold War and our fears around that [note: not a love of mine, just reminds me of the times}).

    Outside of all that nostalgia, this season had a story that was severely lacking. Here are some of the things I had problems with:
    - Tropey (sp) storytelling: E.g. Hopper telling Joyce to turn the key at the count of three, and being hit at 2.  That is such an 80s movie cliche, and infuriating. 
    - What happened to everyone effected by the mind flayer (Billy, the life guard, her parents, the old lady)? Did they concoct a new story about how they died? And, if so, why wasn't that part of the news clip at the very end? All that included was things from season 1 and 2 (please correct me if I am wrong).
    - Is Hopper being held by Russians? This sorry attempt at an 80s cliffhanger rings hollow.
    - Robin's crush on Steve. This came across as a true crush on him. She talked about how she would always watch him. The turnabout felt unnatural. Note: I still love Robin as a character (despite not fully buying into her picking up the Russian language that quickly), and I absolutely buy that Steve would be that supportive and cool after he found out about her. 
    - Lack of storytelling around Lucas, Max, Will. Mike's storyline was pretty lacking too, but I'm not complaining since he is my least favorite character. Everyone else just stood around and had reaction shots to what was happening. 
    - Hopper's change in character. His character traits were just off this season. As Jim mentioned in a few of the podcasts, his story just didn't add up this season. 
    - Joyce was annoying. That is all.
    - Nancy played the part of lots of 80s heroes. Mess up/fumble around until it's time to be heroic. It was annoying.
    - Max suffering/grieving in silence at the end. What was that about? Felt unnatural. Does she not feel she can open up to her friends about what happened? Tell us more. 


    These are just some of the problems I had. Am I the only one? Anyone else think it was lacking? 
    Let’s just start off with they had about 8 hours to tell a story containing 10 main characters and then another 10 supporting characters. It’s not like they could spend an hour on Hopper. So with that being said. 

    Tropey: pretty sure it’s supposed to be. The series is a nostalgia fest. Plus Every movie/show has a formula and this is no exception. I was actually surprised by the terminator at 2. Ultimately I think it does have enough of its own flavour to stand on its own. 

    Robin/Steve love. They spent a lot of time on that. And while maybe the backstory wasn’t earned them falling in love was certainly earned. The scenes with them were great. 

    I disagree. Especially with Lucas. I think we are supposed to understand from his Sister that he’s a nerd and weak. But throughout the season he’s the badass we have come to know. And him and Mike has their moments with the girl problems. Mikes storyline was pretty straightforward. He wanted to tell El he loved her but couldn’t. It was a pretty good theme throughout the season. 

    For me hopper was the best part of this season so maybe it’s just a disagreement on character development and ways they went with him. I think they intentionally meant for him to be Ensure of himself. Thus the comment by the conspiracy theory guy telling him to man up. 

    I don’t see Nancy fumbling or messing up at all. She was Ripley and Sarah Connor rolled into one. She was a bad ass the entire season. 

    Lastly I think they left things open cuz they know there is a season 4 yet it isn’t written. So yes there will be so loose strings and storylines that feel unfinished or not complete. It gives them the ability the write season 4. 
    awookieeTravisAussieGreg
  • DeeDee Adelaide
    The movie tropes are a very deliberate choice. This show is a love letter to anyone who’s a sucker for 80s nostalgia (eg: me). It’s The Goldbergs with monsters. If you don’t like movie tropes and cheesy 80s references, this is definitely not the show for you. 

    I’ve seen a lot written about Hopper, and honestly, he didn’t seem all that different to me. He was a shambling, angry mess in S1 from his very first scene. And they established early on he’s not the most socially switched on person. I don’t know, maybe I need to rewatch S1 and 2 to see the difference. 

    The only complaint I really have is that aside from trashing Castle Byers, Will had nothing to do but stand around touching his neck and looking worried. Noah Schnapp is arguably the best of the (very good) child actors, but he gets shortchanged every season. I hope he takes more of a lead in S4. 
    HatoriankojiattwoodTravis
  • edited July 9
    I think S3 was a return to form after S2. The interrogation scene with Steve and Robyn was the best thing I've seen on the show. I have nitpicks here and there, but my only consistent problem was the Erica character. The dialogue was bad; her acting was bad. I feel like I'm taking crazy pills because everyone else on the internet seems to love her. My feelings aside, I am sorry you didn't enjoy it. It really sucks when something doesn't click and you lose a show you love. Go watch Dark? Its better anyways.
    lawgirl2528
  • rhcooprhcoop Knoxville, Tn
    Erica was the only thing I didn't like about this season.  I got tired of her and the attitude real quick.  

    I hope the writers really roll their sleeves up with her if she's going to be a part of season 4, I can't handle sass and smartass alone as a character's traits.  

    It's pretty unrealistic for Lucas to put up with so much lip from a younger sibling, even if she is a girl.  I kept waiting to see an atomic wedgie or something. 
  • Yeah, either you love the whole embrace of 80's ridiculousness this show does, tropey and incredibly unlikely story telling included, or you don't. 
  • I didn't hate it, but did anyone else think from last season that Hopper and Dustin might have been infected by the mind flayer because they got that stuff on them from that thing on the wall in the tunnels, they cleaned it off, but it seems like a deliberate linger on the shot, hinting they might be infected. (this is all from memory so I could be wrong, and if someone talked about it in other thread or on the pod I haven't listened yet.)
  • All the ChickensAll the Chickens Birmingham, AL
    In previous seasons, Hopper was never really challenged by children like he is this season or dealing with a potential romantic relationship with anyone. He was just a police officer dealing with a bunch of kids and monsters.

    In season 2, he did have to deal with Eleven and their tense father/daughter relationship. And in the scenes where Hopper was actually around Eleven early in the season, he did blow up with anger almost every time. So I don't really see how his behavior was changed, more so than his situation has changed. They did lean more into the comical side of Hoppers anger and paranoia, so perhaps it was more in your face?
    awookiee
  • Joyce was right about everything including moving away from the hellmouth and having hopper doubt her made no sense. Will has never been given anything to do in this show. New characters were great. Hopper just became a caricature of himself which was disappointing. I found possessed billy less aggressive and violent than regular billy. The Russian stuff was ridiculous but did feel like the most 80s movie thing possible with Russians underneath a mall on the Fourth of July with only our teen heroes to stop them. It’s better than two thankfully 
  • I haven't understood the dislike of the Hopper arc and his emotional state this season. Here was an angry man kicked in the face by life who suddenly gets a daughter to take care of and without the normal ramp up to puberty a real parent would deal with he's there within a year or two and is thrown off his game with the idea boys are going to be going after his girl.

    The 80's middle aged man wasn't exactly in touch with their feelings and I think they wrote him rather well. It played out how I would have expected my father, his friends and the fathers of my friends to act in those years. Being able to have a heart to heart talk wasn't very high on a man's list of skills. That's why the scenes with Joyce seem strange and stupid but the adult men I knew back then rarely had a heart to heart and with great difficulty. That is why when we find out what he added to Joyce's speech it is really powerful.

    The few times my father opened up to me I could see how hard it was and was so awkward we both wanted it to end as soon as possible. Usually they could only have a serious talk with a friend after the two of them were alone and  totally shitfaced. A lot of the fathers at that time were Vietnam vets and they kept every emotion locked down most of the time.
    awookieekojiattwoodDeeAll the Chickens
  • DeeDee Adelaide
    @CapeGabe Yeah, maybe it’s a “you had to be there” thing, but I keep reading things about Hopper being terrifying yelling at a kid and yelling at a woman for missing a date and blah blah abusive and just... no. That’s 80s dudes. Everyone’s dad was like that and no one thought anything of it. Kids weren’t traumatised being screamed at by their dads in the 80s - it was just something that happened. Which is not to say that’s a good thing, and it’s much nicer that it’s not really acceptable to do that anymore, but you have to put it in context. This is not millennial dad we are talking about. 
    TravisCapeGabe
  • Dee said:
    @CapeGabe Yeah, maybe it’s a “you had to be there” thing, but I keep reading things about Hopper being terrifying yelling at a kid and yelling at a woman for missing a date and blah blah abusive and just... no. That’s 80s dudes. Everyone’s dad was like that and no one thought anything of it. Kids weren’t traumatised being screamed at by their dads in the 80s - it was just something that happened. Which is not to say that’s a good thing, and it’s much nicer that it’s not really acceptable to do that anymore, but you have to put it in context. This is not millennial dad we are talking about. 

    To paraphrase Bill Burr on growing up in the 70's and 80's: My father never hit me but it was always strongly implied that there would be violence if we stepped out of line. And if that didn't work then my mother would kick the shit out of us.
    Deekojiattwood
  • JoshuaHeterJoshuaHeter Omaha, NE
    I loved the season, but I’m also on board with Jim & Aron that what they did with Erica’s character (in terms of sass) was a bit much. In previous seasons it was funny / charming. This season it was fairly off-putting.

    It’s one thing to have that sort of attitude with your older brother. It’s totally different to have it with family friends or strangers. And it was *really* turned up to 11. Whenever I encounter kids like that (either in media or real life), I can’t help but think that their parents have failed them.

    Wow that went on longer than I planned for a fairly minor gripe.
    rhcoop
  • Hate is a strong word. I found myself, by episode 5, thinking the previous 4 episodes have been them doing the same thing. But the last few episodes rescue the season. I thought they spent too much time with the adults. 

    I still enjoyed it. From a quality perspective, I could see why this season was better than last, but S1 just had all the right beats for me. 
  • JaimieTJaimieT Atlanta, GA
    Dee said:
    @CapeGabe Yeah, maybe it’s a “you had to be there” thing, but I keep reading things about Hopper being terrifying yelling at a kid and yelling at a woman for missing a date and blah blah abusive and just... no. That’s 80s dudes. Everyone’s dad was like that and no one thought anything of it. Kids weren’t traumatised being screamed at by their dads in the 80s - it was just something that happened. Which is not to say that’s a good thing, and it’s much nicer that it’s not really acceptable to do that anymore, but you have to put it in context. This is not millennial dad we are talking about. 

    I was extremely traumatized by it personally. But evidently my siblings were not! (I secretly think they were.) I haven't seen the season so I'm way out of line commenting on the nature of the screaming at children, though. 
  • Hate is a strong word. I found myself, by episode 5, thinking the previous 4 episodes have been them doing the same thing. But the last few episodes rescue the season. I thought they spent too much time with the adults. 

    I still enjoyed it. S1 was my favorite, and I still got some emotional feels from the scene with the Byers family moving. 
  • JaimieT said:

    I was extremely traumatized by it personally. But evidently my siblings were not! (I secretly think they were.) I haven't seen the season so I'm way out of line commenting on the nature of the screaming at children, though. 

    There wasn't really any screaming at kids in the show. Just an off screen scaring to stay away from his daughter. 

    The screaming at kids were our part of the discussion on how some people thinking that it being hard for middle aged fathers in the 80's to healthily show emotions didn't ring true.

    It was my experience that most fathers I knew in the 80's were fairly emotionally crippled. 
    JaimieT
  • I love the comments here. Ok, after further thought, I didn’t hate it. To me, it was the weakest season because it relied too heavily on 80s commercial references (I think the soviet plot line did it for me). To me, I rank the seasons 2, 1 and 3. Season 2 had really hit a stride there. 
  • DeeDee Adelaide
    Yeah, sorry @JaimieT - @CapeGabe explained it better. What I meant was that other people are saying he was screaming at children and women and that I didn’t really see that. He was angry and over-reacted to dumb stuff but I feel like that’s been his character since the start, and it is contextually realistic for those of us who grew up in the 80s and had dads who were either not talking at all or yelling over dumb shit. 

    I know the idea of what’s abusive and what isn’t is very subjective, and maybe the people who are saying Hopper was this season are seeing it from their own experiences. But I guess I just didn’t see it personally. 
    CapeGabeJaimieT
  • JaimieTJaimieT Atlanta, GA
    @Dee @CapeGabe

    Oh I know what you mean. And yes. Self-moderation was not a thing lol. 
    Dee
  • All the ChickensAll the Chickens Birmingham, AL
    edited July 10
    My dad and stepdad were no where near what you would think of as being aggressive or abusive with their family. My stepdad coached sports and could push me competitively, but nothing like yelling a lot or any physical abuse. 

    In spite of all of that and feeling safe around them, I still cannot imagine acting towards either of them how Mike acted towards Hopper, or really any adult male figure in my life (especially my 13 year old girlfriends police chief dad). Hopper should be given a medal for not literally tossing Mike out of his home. Although part of Hoppers reservation may have been due to knowing that El is still in the process of learning social norms, and that she could seriously hurt him if she thought he was being unreasonably mean or violent towards Mike.

    I know people say "he's just being a teenager" but even as a teenager who had a rebellious streak and a smug attitude towards adults at times, there's no fucking way I would do what Mike did. I don't know if it's because of the direction Finn Wolfhard was given that he just notched up his aggressiveness and shittiness towards Hopper in those scenes to "completely unreasonable," or if we are just supposed to understand that Mike's boldness is due to his dad being a pile of vanilla pudding. It was the one complaint that both my wife and I had in the early part of the season - not because it was all that unrealistic, but just because it was annoying.
    TravisCapeGabe
  • rhcooprhcoop Knoxville, Tn
    My dad and stepdad were no where near what you would think of as being aggressive or abusive with their family. My stepdad coached sports and could push me competitively, but nothing like yelling a lot or any physical abuse. 

    In spite of all of that and feeling safe around them, I still cannot imagine acting towards either of them how Mike acted towards Hopper, or really any adult male figure in my life (especially my 13 year old girlfriends police chief dad). Hopper should be given a medal for not literally tossing Mike out of his home. Although part of Hoppers reservation may have been due to knowing that El is still in the process of learning social norms, and that she could seriously hurt him if she thought he was being unreasonably mean or violent towards Mike.

    I know people say "he's just being a teenager" but even as a teenager who had a rebellious streak and a smug attitude towards adults at times, there's no fucking way I would do what Mike did. I don't know if it's because of the direction Finn Wolfhard was given that he just notched up his aggressiveness and shittiness towards Hopper in those scenes to "completely unreasonable," or if we are just supposed to understand that Mike's boldness is due to his dad being a pile of vanilla pudding. It was the one complaint that both my wife and I had in the early part of the season - not because it was all that unrealistic, but just because it was annoying.
    It would have been death for me if I had have dared talk to my parents or any of my friends/girlfriends parents like that when I was that age.  

    I totally agree, I kept waiting for Hopper to literally drag him out the front door during that part of the show.   He was awful patient with them even having the door closed IMO.  They are only 12-14, right?  
    TravisCapeGabe
  • TravisTravis CA
    edited July 10
    My biggest thing with this season, and J&A touched on it in the coverage, but it's the kind of reverse Netflix/Marvel problem where they would stretch 6 episodes of content into 13. This season of Stranger Things was 13 episodes condensed into 8 and it left it feeling a bit rushed and scattered. Kind of like it was trying to be too many things at once where if you stretched it out a bit there would have been a more natural flow to the whole thing. It also ate away at some of the suspense that it had no real time to breathe. There were a lot of moments that I really wanted that we never got because it was too big of a scope for 8 episodes.

    I can also understand a lot of the other complaints, and I can see them and agree that they were present none of them bother me. The show is just so damned fun and charming and the characters are so great and the nostalgia hits me so perfectly that it gets a 100 foot retractable lead from me. I love these characters and I love spending time in Hawkins. I wish there were more opportunities to spend time there. I think that is why the rushed nature of the show is the one thing that stuck. There was so much less catching up with the people and it was all reacting to things. They still nailed all the points for me. I had a blast the whole way through, but it could have been so much more with just more time. I really loved this season and I really love this show, but I think this might be the weakest season because it's more of a sugar high and perhaps the joy is a bit less sustainable than the previous seasons.
  • Mike's arrogance didn't bug me. If I was twelve with a girlfriend who could kill things with her mind I would have been the biggest dickhead the world had ever seen.
    TravisDee
  • You have to realize Netflix only gave them eight episodes. And, on top of all that, the Duffer Brothers had A LOT of pressure on them, because of the success of the show. Every little mistake is pointed out, and that's not fair to them. I must admit, though, The Lost Sister episode in season two was not very favorable.

    Anyways, here is my rating for the seasons, least to greatest:
    1-Season One
    2-Season Three
    3-Season Two

    Also, here is a Stranger Things game about Eleven in the Upside-Down.
    https://invertedearththeory.itch.io/elevenbetween-12
    Travis
  • You have to realize Netflix only gave them eight episodes. And, on top of all that, the Duffer Brothers had A LOT of pressure on them, because of the success of the show. Every little mistake is pointed out, and that's not fair to them. I must admit, though, The Lost Sister episode in season two was not very favorable.

    I can dig that, but it doesn't change the viewing experience. It is nice to know because it does help to explain where the blame belongs. That said, for me at least, I have no frustration at the season (though I could see it reading that way). It's more like an unfulfilled wish for what could have been. I had a fantastic time watching it. I love the show, but taking that filter off and asking the question of "how could this have been better" the answer is pretty clear to me. If that's Netflix's fault, that isn't terribly surprising, but imagine how great that season could have been with 10 or even 12 episodes to give the whole thing more oxygen and more time to enjoy the continued development of the characters.

    Like I said, I'm not mad at it at all. I really, really enjoyed it, but I can't help but wonder what could have been.
  • Travis said:
    You have to realize Netflix only gave them eight episodes. And, on top of all that, the Duffer Brothers had A LOT of pressure on them, because of the success of the show. Every little mistake is pointed out, and that's not fair to them. I must admit, though, The Lost Sister episode in season two was not very favorable.

    I can dig that, but it doesn't change the viewing experience. It is nice to know because it does help to explain where the blame belongs. That said, for me at least, I have no frustration at the season (though I could see it reading that way). It's more like an unfulfilled wish for what could have been. I had a fantastic time watching it. I love the show, but taking that filter off and asking the question of "how could this have been better" the answer is pretty clear to me. If that's Netflix's fault, that isn't terribly surprising, but imagine how great that season could have been with 10 or even 12 episodes to give the whole thing more oxygen and more time to enjoy the continued development of the characters.

    Like I said, I'm not mad at it at all. I really, really enjoyed it, but I can't help but wonder what could have been.
    Yeah, totally. There were plenty of chances to make it better. And, yeah, more episodes would've been a lot cooler.
    Travis
  • You have to realize Netflix only gave them eight episodes. And, on top of all that, the Duffer Brothers had A LOT of pressure on them, because of the success of the show. Every little mistake is pointed out, and that's not fair to them. I must admit, though, The Lost Sister episode in season two was not very favorable.

    Anyways, here is my rating for the seasons, least to greatest:
    1-Season One
    2-Season Three
    3-Season Two

    Also, here is a Stranger Things game about Eleven in the Upside-Down.
    https://invertedearththeory.itch.io/elevenbetween-12
    I agree with your ranking, but am laughing at the comment about it not being fair to have every little mistake being pointed out. It's not like people are pointing out coffee cups and water bottles as front page news. <span>:wink:</span>
    TravisInvertedEarthTheory
  • mtron32mtron32 San Diego
    Season 2 was better, it seems like the children have outgrown their roles.  It also seems as if El has regressed from where she'd grown in season 2.  Dustin's GF arc was dumb and ended with a cringe worthy long song at the worst time and Lukas's sister was pretty annoying.  Joyce should have had a smaller role this season but they insisted on roping her in based on some magnets falling from her fridge?  

    They would have probably been better off making this series an anthology tied together by the upside down but in different locations around the country; tons of 80s nostalgia to mine throughout the states.  Instead, they're really trying hard to find something for all these kids to do while shooting around those growth spurts.  Maybe focus on some teens in Santa Cruz or New Orleans?  

    Ah well, I'll watch season 4 when it drops but I'll keep my fast forward button primed.  I didn't hate this season but I had much less joy than the last two.
    Teresa from ConcordMarci
  • CapeGabe said:
    Mike's arrogance didn't bug me. If I was twelve with a girlfriend who could kill things with her mind I would have been the biggest dickhead the world had ever seen.
    The other thing to keep in mind is Mike already has at least a little rapport with Hopper from the first 2 seasons and Hopper might be giving him a little extra leniency because of the whole situation of Hopper hiding her from them almost the entire 2nd season.  That most certainly doesn't excuse his asshole behavior to Hopper in the first episode but add that to Mike's over confidence because he's the significant other of a ridiculously powerful girl and it does lighten my issue with the believability of his attitude towards Hopper. 
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