Gotham - 2:01 - Rise of the Villains: Damned If You Do...

Did anyone watch last night? It seems the talk of a new direction for this season wasn't just hot air. I like what I saw alot.
Frakkin TAManIsNoOneTravis

Comments

  • Missed it last night, because my Jets were playing MNF. But I plan on watching tonight. I love the actor they have playing the young Joker.
    Travis
  • Frakkin TFrakkin T Currently Offline
    I liked it a lot too. It's hard to see how Gordon is ever going to name his daughter Barbara though, and I hope this kid is not the Joker. The pre-season 1 buzz was that they were going to tease the Joker over multiple seasons, and even give us a few fake-outs. I hope that's true, because the one thing the Joker does not need is an origin story.

    I am glad they got rid of the rival mob bosses, and especially glad they got rid of Fish. They missed a great opportunity to kill her earlier last year, when the old man discovered that she planted the girl. She wasn't a bad character but she definitely outstayed her welcome and I'm glad she's gone.

    Travis
  • @Frakkin T   I thought they confirmed over the summer that this was going to be the actual Joker. I could be wrong.
  • How is this show compared to something like SHIELD or Arrow or The Flash? Is it worth picking up or do you have to have an appreciation and understanding of Batman lore to enjoy it?
  • Frakkin TFrakkin T Currently Offline
    @AntManBee I think you're right but I hope it was a fake-out.

    @bizmarkiefader I don't watch Arrow or the Flash but I can tell you it's so much better than Shield, which is an awful awful show. You don't need to be a Batman fan to appreciate Gotham, but it helps. I'm sure even non-fans know a few of the characters, like Catwoman, Riddler, Alfred, Commissioner Gordon. There are a lot of fan-service easter egss but it's hardly the main draw of the show. Gotham stands on its own as a good cop drama with some fantastical elements. 
    ksa1001AManIsNoOneTravis
  • edited September 2015
    I did not like season 1 very much but the finale was good so I watched the season 2 opener. Looks like they are taking the show away from the silly and more down a darker route which is great. Gone are a lot of bad characters too. So I'm sticking around. Thumbs up so far.
    ksa1001AManIsNoOneTravis
  • Looks like a positive consensus overall. I have faith in the writers and cast to mold something + out of all of this. I'm in!
    Travis
  • edited September 2015
    Watched this last night. I did like it, but I'm wondering about a couple things. What's the deal with the James Frain character? Did he break those patients out of Arkham in order to form his own early version of the Suicide Squad? Is Barbara going to be Harley Quinn? If that's the case, it seems to be going against what I know as Batman canon. But I am far from an expert. I'd like someone who really knows the Batman universe to set me straight.
    Frakkin TTravis
  • Frakkin TFrakkin T Currently Offline
    Harley Quinn's real name is Harleen Quinzel; she was a psychiatrist at Arkham who fell under the Joker's spell and broke bad. I am not 100% against Barbara being Harley, but it would surprise me because it would be a complete rewrite of canon. If they do it they'd better do it perfectly or else a lot of people are going to stop watching, including me. 

    (On a meta note, I don't think Gotham is going to touch Harley because of how hard Margot Robbie is going to rock the character next year in Suicide Squad.)
    AntManBeeTravis
  • AManIsNoOneAManIsNoOne Greensboro, NC
    Full disclosure, I'm a Batman fan and I did watch season 1 of Gotham. I thought season 1 was good, but far from great. After finally watching the first episode of season 2, I'm blown away. I thought this opening episode was nearly flawless, especially considering it's on Fox.

    As far as casting goes, the only character I'm less than impressed with is the Riddler. I think 90% of the other actors are knocking it out of the park. And my goodness Tabitha...a girl that hot could talk me into almost anything.
    AntManBeeArctorTravis
  • I finally caught it yesterday and I really enjoyed it. It really feels like they figured something out as far as the sort of "voice of the show" goes. I ultimately liked season 1, but was a little on the luke warm side because it just felt like there was too much clutter. I don't remember who said it above, but I am super psyched that they cleared up the whole mob power struggle. I think that will clear things up and improve the focus of the show a great deal. It should be noted that I know nothing about the comics and the canon of it all, but as someone who has no reference and thus no ability to be disappointed by them changing things and screwing them up I'm excited to see where this whole "crime team" business goes. It looks like things are going to be really fun this season.

    As far as the show stacking against Arrow, Flash and Shield, I think that at its best it is on par with Arrow and the Flash but factoring in consistency I think those shows are better. To qualify, Arrow is my favorite of the shows, and I could see Flash falling behind this year (I'm not sure why, just a feeling but I'm just not as excited for its return as I thought I would be). Given the direction they may be heading I think it could make for some interesting competition. Gotham is better than Shield (though I will credit Shield with improving, but it's still kind of a "meh" show in my book and truth be told as much as I did have fun watching season 2 I doubt I'll be watching it going forward unless I get curious and binge a bunch of it during a slower period like I did last year).

  • kingbee67kingbee67 Los Angeles Ca.
    I guess Gotham PD is hiring. That was some dark shit, and I loved it.
    TravisAManIsNoOneSheIsGeeky
  • Yeah, it looks like their really trying to capture the tone of the Tim Burton movies. I was always a fan of both.
    Travis
  • edited October 2015
    I didnt care for most episodes as a whole in S1 but this was pretty good. Probably the best one they've done. It could be because I love James Frain but it was good except for horrible Barbara.

    I remember hearing the "teasing of the joker in S1" but I doubt they have another in store for this show. That guy would be acting just like Joker for no reason.

    I basically know nothing from the comics. Is that bald guy with Penguin a comic book character? I forget his name.

    Also, isnt that Sironi guy suppose to be Black Mask? They killed him off so I'm a lil confused. I know he is in S2 of 12 Monkeys so maybe his schedule was packed
  • AManIsNoOneAManIsNoOne Greensboro, NC
    Just got done watching episode 3....STANDING OVATION...anybody else watched it yet?
    manhattnik
  • ArctorArctor The Netherlands
    @AManIsNoOne Yes, it was friggin' awesome! The most suspenseful episode of the show yet in my opinion. And holy crap that ending gave me chills.
    AManIsNoOnemanhattnik
  • AManIsNoOneAManIsNoOne Greensboro, NC
    ****SPOILER****
    ****SPOILER****
    ****SPOILER****





    @Arctor Totally, and I love how they finished off the Joker fakeout. So while Jerome wasn't The Joker, he was actually the inspiration for him. 

    His performance was one that I will never forget. Obviously on a different scale and scope than big screen depictions, but in my opinion, just as good. If that's not high praise, I don't know what is. 

    If I hand two more hands, I'd give Jerome 4 thumbs up. 
    AntManBeemanhattnik
  • ArctorArctor The Netherlands
    **** SPOILER ****

    @AManIsNoOne Most definitely! He was like a proto-Joker. Also I really liked how they set up the viral aspect of his 'legacy' so he's actually more than just this character, he's a catalyst for bad shit to come. He will live on in these brutal stabbings and chaos and eventually in the actual Joker when he shows up.

    Acting was also top notch all around. Alfred was a total badass and I especially liked Barbara's expression when she got kicked in the crotch, so sweet :D
    manhattnik
  • Frakkin TFrakkin T Currently Offline
    I haven't seen ep.3 yet, but I am glad to read these spoilers. The kid was pretty good, but he clearly was pulling a lot from Ledger. I'm glad they gave us a fakeout; it was way too early to do the real Joker. 
    AManIsNoOne
  • That was a great bait and switch by the producers of this show. They sure had me believing that was Joker. Really nice twist. I agree that it would have been too early to introduce the Joker, but I also think they have Penguin rising up too early as well. So it would have been somewhat consistent. Also I've made it no secret here on other threads, but I am a big fan of Cameron Monaghan. I would have loved to see him play a young Joker in this series. Nevertheless, I respect what they did. Now I'm looking forward to what happens next.

    manhattnik
  • Frakkin TFrakkin T Currently Offline
    Was it in the Nolan movies where Bruce Wayne said that Batman was always intended to be a symbol first instead of a man, so that anyone could take over the cowl? I like that we saw that here with the Joker. I don't think the Gotham-style Muppet Babies origin story would work with the character because there would be no mystery. The coolest thing about Ledger's Joker for me was how many times he told a different story about how he got the scars and you never got a sense that one of them was a lie or one was "more true." Part of what makes Joker so chaotic and scary is that he seems to have come from nowhere; I like that they can now have several different Jokers over time and stack the madness and the mythology side by side so that when the real one emerges there will be so much that's come before to set it up BUT the Joker himself can be as much a mystery as the writers want him to be. 
    AManIsNoOneAntManBee
  • manhattnikmanhattnik the big apple
    Wow. Just wow. The best Gotham so far. And, yeah, syke. Loved it.
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