@johnnytruant - The cast covers the first few eps, and yes, it's spoilery. Very difficult to talk about this show without being spoilery.
Ah, thanks. Guess I'll have to try an episode. I'm always hesitant to start Netflix shows cause most times I'll end up bingeing even if I'm not into it.
@johnnytruant - The cast covers the first few eps, and yes, it's spoilery. Very difficult to talk about this show without being spoilery.
Ah, thanks. Guess I'll have to try an episode. I'm always hesitant to start Netflix shows cause most times I'll end up bingeing even if I'm not into it.
I’d recommend watching more than one, the 1st one sets things up, but takes about 4-5 to actually “get going”.
I burned through Altered Carbon this weekend. Some thoughts:
Lead actors were weak. Joel Kinnaman - This guy is exactly the same in this show as he was on House of Cards and last couple roles. Same notes, expressions, the works. I liked this character most, when it wasn't played Kinnaman. Marta Higareda as Ortega simply didn't have the range this show was asking of her. Purefoy was acceptable as the uber-rich asshole. Dichen Lachman, who I don't normally like, gave one of the better performances. Secondary cast gave the most interesting performances.
There was a lot fat that could have been trimmed out of this season. Too many head fakes made the crime investigation a bit tedious. Most critics are right: The back half of this season was far more interesting than the first half.
The sci-fi world building is incredible, but it's like they tried to cram too many concepts into this story. Just the idea of sleeves is enough. But they added tons of secondary concepts, that served more as distractions, than interesting elements that contributed to the story. There could be some fantastic stories built in this universe. I hope they keep the show, but treat it more like an anthology.
@hypergenesb I agree with a lot of what you're saying here! Although I have to defend Kinnaman only slightly. I thought he had at least a few moments where he did some decent acting, even though I admit it was also often weak and similar to other roles he's done.
But somehow he at least made me like his character a bit more than the female actor who played Ortega, did with hers. I don't usually use the word "hate" a lot, but man, I truly hated the character Ortega! I hated everything about her; the weak acting, the way the character was written. I don't know why but I cringed when she sometimes suddenly spoke Spanish... She felt like a minor, cartoonish character, who was mistakenly given a bigger role.
The show sorely lacked likable or even interesting characters, to me. I found myself liking the AI Hotel receptionist guy. Lol. Also, there were only a couple of scenes in the whole show that moved me, emotionally. And he was in one of those scenes.
I liked the visuals a lot, that was a positive. But unfortunately it felt like the visuals were the show's strongest card. Like walking around in a beautiful, futuristic Madame Tussauds museum of wax dolls... Looks great but has no heart, or pulse....
Perhaps I am unfair because my expectations were sky high... But this show just didn't do it for me. I would still give a S2 a chance, just to see if they change it in some way. The premise/main storyline did have some potential..
so im thru the first two episodes but i have a huge question. Are humans and sleeves one in the same? Are people born? Are sleeves created in a lab or real humans who have died? The entire concept is wild and just kind of dawned on me.
I burned through Altered Carbon this weekend. Some thoughts:
Lead actors were weak. Joel Kinnaman - This guy is exactly the same in this show as he was on House of Cards and last couple roles. Same notes, expressions, the works. I liked this character most, when it wasn't played Kinnaman. Marta Higareda as Ortega simply didn't have the range this show was asking of her. Purefoy was acceptable as the uber-rich asshole. Dichen Lachman, who I don't normally like, gave one of the better performances. Secondary cast gave the most interesting performances.
There was a lot fat that could have been trimmed out of this season. Too many head fakes made the crime investigation a bit tedious. Most critics are right: The back half of this season was far more interesting than the first half.
The sci-fi world building is incredible, but it's like they tried to cram too many concepts into this story. Just the idea of sleeves is enough. But they added tons of secondary concepts, that served more as distractions, than interesting elements that contributed to the story. There could be some fantastic stories built in this universe. I hope they keep the show, but treat it more like an anthology.
@hypergenesb I agree with a lot of what you're saying here! Although I have to defend Kinnaman only slightly. I thought he had at least a few moments where he did some decent acting, even though I admit it was also often weak and similar to other roles he's done.
But somehow he at least made me like his character a bit more than the female actor who played Ortega, did with hers. I don't usually use the word "hate" a lot, but man, I truly hated the character Ortega! I hated everything about her; the weak acting, the way the character was written. I don't know why but I cringed when she sometimes suddenly spoke Spanish... She felt like a minor, cartoonish character, who was mistakenly given a bigger role.
The show sorely lacked likable or even interesting characters, to me. I found myself liking the AI Hotel receptionist guy. Lol. Also, there were only a couple of scenes in the whole show that moved me, emotionally. And he was in one of those scenes.
I liked the visuals a lot, that was a positive. But unfortunately it felt like the visuals were the show's strongest card. Like walking around in a beautiful, futuristic Madame Tussauds museum of wax dolls... Looks great but has no heart, or pulse....
Perhaps I am unfair because my expectations were sky high... But this show just didn't do it for me. I would still give a S2 a chance, just to see if they change it in some way. The premise/main storyline did have some potential..
I share a similar experience watching Altered Carbon as you did. I think the show needed more likable characters to hold your hand while they explored the world. I don't always think a show or movie have to have likeable characters, but when you have so many new or convoluted concepts a likeable character helps. Kinnaman has the same problem on this show as he did in Robocop, he is expected to play " everyman" except he has no range. Ortega is also very dull, she has two things working against her. First Ortega is playing a cliche , character that is starting to get old ... " police woman". I may have more exposure to this than most, because I watch a lot of Netflix shows, but Netflix loves "Cop Woman" archetype. She starts off hard as nails and then becomes generic girlfriend. Also , Ortega seems to swing widely in her reactions to situations, to the point it seems like the character had off screen changes happen to her.
I burned through Altered Carbon this weekend. Some thoughts:
Lead actors were weak. Joel Kinnaman - This guy is exactly the same in this show as he was on House of Cards and last couple roles. Same notes, expressions, the works. I liked this character most, when it wasn't played Kinnaman. Marta Higareda as Ortega simply didn't have the range this show was asking of her. Purefoy was acceptable as the uber-rich asshole. Dichen Lachman, who I don't normally like, gave one of the better performances. Secondary cast gave the most interesting performances.
There was a lot fat that could have been trimmed out of this season. Too many head fakes made the crime investigation a bit tedious. Most critics are right: The back half of this season was far more interesting than the first half.
The sci-fi world building is incredible, but it's like they tried to cram too many concepts into this story. Just the idea of sleeves is enough. But they added tons of secondary concepts, that served more as distractions, than interesting elements that contributed to the story. There could be some fantastic stories built in this universe. I hope they keep the show, but treat it more like an anthology.
@hypergenesb I agree with a lot of what you're saying here! Although I have to defend Kinnaman only slightly. I thought he had at least a few moments where he did some decent acting, even though I admit it was also often weak and similar to other roles he's done.
But somehow he at least made me like his character a bit more than the female actor who played Ortega, did with hers. I don't usually use the word "hate" a lot, but man, I truly hated the character Ortega! I hated everything about her; the weak acting, the way the character was written. I don't know why but I cringed when she sometimes suddenly spoke Spanish... She felt like a minor, cartoonish character, who was mistakenly given a bigger role.
The show sorely lacked likable or even interesting characters, to me. I found myself liking the AI Hotel receptionist guy. Lol. Also, there were only a couple of scenes in the whole show that moved me, emotionally. And he was in one of those scenes.
I liked the visuals a lot, that was a positive. But unfortunately it felt like the visuals were the show's strongest card. Like walking around in a beautiful, futuristic Madame Tussauds museum of wax dolls... Looks great but has no heart, or pulse....
Perhaps I am unfair because my expectations were sky high... But this show just didn't do it for me. I would still give a S2 a chance, just to see if they change it in some way. The premise/main storyline did have some potential..
I share a similar experience watching Altered Carbon as you did. I think the show needed more likable characters to hold your hand while they explored the world. I don't always think a show or movie have to have likeable characters, but when you have so many new or convoluted concepts a likeable character helps. Kinnaman has the same problem on this show as he did in Robocop, he is expected to play " everyman" except he has no range. Ortega is also very dull, she has two things working against her. First Ortega is playing a cliche , character that is starting to get old ... " police woman". I may have more exposure to this than most, because I watch a lot of Netflix shows, but Netflix loves "Cop Woman" archetype. She starts off hard as nails and then becomes generic girlfriend. Also , Ortega seems to swing widely in her reactions to situations, to the point it seems like the character had off screen changes happen to her.
@ojr Good to know someone understands what I am talking about.. You complemented my thoughts about the show in a very nice way!
Ok, now to more thoughts on Kinnaman, and am sorry for defending him, but us Swedes don't have that many big names in Hollywood.. or any kind of names... so bear with me.
I am a little (read: very) disappointed in my countryman Joel Kinnaman lately, cause after I saw him in "The Killing", I actually started to have a lot of respect for him, since I think he did a very fine acting job indeed, in that role!
In his role in The Killing I thought he had a very good range of emotions; he could be cool, annoyed, a badass, funny.... and do a lot of subtle work, in how he cared about his cop partner, and his nephew. The range really showed, when he also portrayed how he struggled with his drug addiction and his way, waaay "darker side". Anyone who hasn't seen that show, IMO, hasn't seen his "true" quality, as an actor. And I think it is a damn shame that he hasn't been able to find that talent within himself, again. But perhaps he might still..
I will still tune in for AC season 2 in hopes of the show developing to something more.. Did I mention I am a hopeless optimistic...
The episode dominated by the Envoy flashback was perhaps the worst.
I thought the ending was rushed, and somewhat nonsensical. We were treated to a cliched "big bad explains everything" segment, but that final fight sequence was great. Very tense. Overall the action in the series was well done.
To continue with the problems with the ending, I just don't buy it. There is no way that it would play out like it did for those Meths.
I burned through Altered Carbon this weekend. Some thoughts:
Lead actors were weak. Joel Kinnaman - This guy is exactly the same in this show as he was on House of Cards and last couple roles. Same notes, expressions, the works. I liked this character most, when it wasn't played Kinnaman. Marta Higareda as Ortega simply didn't have the range this show was asking of her. Purefoy was acceptable as the uber-rich asshole. Dichen Lachman, who I don't normally like, gave one of the better performances. Secondary cast gave the most interesting performances.
There was a lot fat that could have been trimmed out of this season. Too many head fakes made the crime investigation a bit tedious. Most critics are right: The back half of this season was far more interesting than the first half.
The sci-fi world building is incredible, but it's like they tried to cram too many concepts into this story. Just the idea of sleeves is enough. But they added tons of secondary concepts, that served more as distractions, than interesting elements that contributed to the story. There could be some fantastic stories built in this universe. I hope they keep the show, but treat it more like an anthology.
@hypergenesb I agree with a lot of what you're saying here! Although I have to defend Kinnaman only slightly. I thought he had at least a few moments where he did some decent acting, even though I admit it was also often weak and similar to other roles he's done.
But somehow he at least made me like his character a bit more than the female actor who played Ortega, did with hers. I don't usually use the word "hate" a lot, but man, I truly hated the character Ortega! I hated everything about her; the weak acting, the way the character was written. I don't know why but I cringed when she sometimes suddenly spoke Spanish... She felt like a minor, cartoonish character, who was mistakenly given a bigger role.
The show sorely lacked likable or even interesting characters, to me. I found myself liking the AI Hotel receptionist guy. Lol. Also, there were only a couple of scenes in the whole show that moved me, emotionally. And he was in one of those scenes.
I liked the visuals a lot, that was a positive. But unfortunately it felt like the visuals were the show's strongest card. Like walking around in a beautiful, futuristic Madame Tussauds museum of wax dolls... Looks great but has no heart, or pulse....
Perhaps I am unfair because my expectations were sky high... But this show just didn't do it for me. I would still give a S2 a chance, just to see if they change it in some way. The premise/main storyline did have some potential..
I share a similar experience watching Altered Carbon as you did. I think the show needed more likable characters to hold your hand while they explored the world. I don't always think a show or movie have to have likeable characters, but when you have so many new or convoluted concepts a likeable character helps. Kinnaman has the same problem on this show as he did in Robocop, he is expected to play " everyman" except he has no range. Ortega is also very dull, she has two things working against her. First Ortega is playing a cliche , character that is starting to get old ... " police woman". I may have more exposure to this than most, because I watch a lot of Netflix shows, but Netflix loves "Cop Woman" archetype. She starts off hard as nails and then becomes generic girlfriend. Also , Ortega seems to swing widely in her reactions to situations, to the point it seems like the character had off screen changes happen to her.
@ojr Good to know someone understands what I am talking about.. You complemented my thoughts about the show in a very nice way!
Ok, now to more thoughts on Kinnaman, and am sorry for defending him, but us Swedes don't have that many big names in Hollywood.. or any kind of names... so bear with me.
I am a little (read: very) disappointed in my countryman Joel Kinnaman lately, cause after I saw him in "The Killing", I actually started to have a lot of respect for him, since I think he did a very fine acting job indeed, in that role!
In his role in The Killing I thought he had a very good range of emotions; he could be cool, annoyed, a badass, funny.... and do a lot of subtle work, in how he cared about his cop partner, and his nephew. The range really showed, when he also portrayed how he struggled with his drug addiction and his way, waaay "darker side". Anyone who hasn't seen that show, IMO, hasn't seen his "true" quality, as an actor. And I think it is a damn shame that he hasn't been able to find that talent within himself, again. But perhaps he might still..
I will still tune in for AC season 2 in hopes of the show developing to something more.. Did I mention I am a hopeless optimistic...
Oh, don't get me wrong I loved the show and I can't wait to see more. Criticizing the show is more out of admiration and respect for the show , than anything negative.Kinnaman, is good I just think it was a hard ask for anyone to play his role. Although , the actor who was portraying Ortega's GrandMother did an amazing job.
Yeah, all the Envoy flashback stuff felt like a YA novel.
Yea, I thought some of the training stuff worked, but I didn't really care for the Quell character all that much. She's pretty hokey, and the ethos of "We're Envoys and we take what is offered" is dangerously close to "We take, we do not bother."
Also, I gave an audible groan at "Survive. That's an order."
Otherwise, I thought the show was a lot of fun, and mostly pretty good.
I overall liked the show, but I feel like my absolute hatred for Ortega has soured me on the experience as a whole. I hardly ever hate characters, but this one... my god. Not only is it a less than capable actress, there was absolutely no point to the character. I feel like if we removed her entirely, the story would still make perfect sense and would be actually way better. Seriously, what was the point of her, and what did she do other than being a complete bitch to everyone? She had WAY too much screentime for what she had to offer. I'm still going to watch S2, the worldbuilding was amazing imo and of course the visuals, but man I just pray to the Meths Ortega won't come back.
With all the talent in entertainment, Netflix couldn't find two better actors for the main leads?
Also any society that has miraculous clone stack swapping must be able to develop some sort of verification system for what stack is actually in what sleeve so that shenanigans do not occur.....
I overall liked the show, but I feel like my absolute hatred for Ortega has soured me on the experience as a whole. I hardly ever hate characters, but this one... my god. Not only is it a less than capable actress, there was absolutely no point to the character. I feel like if we removed her entirely, the story would still make perfect sense and would be actually way better. Seriously, what was the point of her, and what did she do other than being a complete bitch to everyone? She had WAY too much screentime for what she had to offer. I'm still going to watch S2, the worldbuilding was amazing imo and of course the visuals, but man I just pray to the Meths Ortega won't come back.
Ha ha, I actually did remove Ortega, by skipping through most of her scenes.
A major problem I had with this story is that I'm totally opposed to the Envoy view that immortality is bad. So from my perspective pretty much everyone in the show was an antagonist.
With all the talent in entertainment, Netflix couldn't find two better actors for the main leads?
Also any society that has miraculous clone stack swapping must be able to develop some sort of verification system for what stack is actually in what sleeve so that shenanigans do not occur.....
I finally got around to watching this show and overall I enjoyed it. I don't think I had as much hatred of characters as others mentioned in this thread. Poe is definitely up there as a favorite. I think my biggest issue with the show is the whole stack/sleeve thing and that literally anyone could be anyone at any time. So it's more like how do you truly ever know. Plus, the bad guy in the end (keeping this as a non-spoiler thread) seem to have a little too much power and such and the bad guy's motive just seemed a little off to me (plus, what they claimed to have done to allow the good guy to continue on, well, how we do know that wasn't just a lie). But like i said, overall, I enjoyed the show. A tad confusing at times which I had to go read up about to make sure i was understanding events but I'd continue to watch if there is a season 2.
They just announced that season two is going to happen!!!!! 8 episodes and Anthony Mackie will be taking over as Takeshi. Be interested to see how he does with such a serious role since he always seems to be more comic relief in most of the films I have seen him in (granted they have all been marvel films)
I keep wanting to rewatch this show. It's like a mind virus. Anyone else feel like this? I don't know what it is about this show... it had its problems, but the mood was really lovely.
I keep wanting to rewatch this show. It's like a mind virus. Anyone else feel like this? I don't know what it is about this show... it had its problems, but the mood was really lovely.
I was thinking about this recently.
It reminded me of '90s sci-fi -- X-Files, Star Trek: TNG.
I thought it was very uneven. I found Ortega and her arc really annoying. The Envoys... flimsy motives, and I didn't find them anywhere near as sympathetic as the show wanted me to. There were a couple of interesting-looking actresses (Hayley Law and Dichen Lachman). I liked the weird, thousands of years long Cersei and Jaime Lannister dynamic between Reileen and Takeshi. Edgar Allen Poe being just ridiculously dropped into the story for no reason was nice. The Reileen clones jumping out of the pods was great horror.
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But somehow he at least made me like his character a bit more than the female actor who played Ortega, did with hers. I don't usually use the word "hate" a lot, but man, I truly hated the character Ortega! I hated everything about her; the weak acting, the way the character was written. I don't know why but I cringed when she sometimes suddenly spoke Spanish... She felt like a minor, cartoonish character, who was mistakenly given a bigger role.
The show sorely lacked likable or even interesting characters, to me. I found myself liking the AI Hotel receptionist guy. Lol.
I liked the visuals a lot, that was a positive. But unfortunately it felt like the visuals were the show's strongest card. Like walking around in a beautiful, futuristic Madame Tussauds museum of wax dolls... Looks great but has no heart, or pulse....
Perhaps I am unfair because my expectations were sky high... But this show just didn't do it for me. I would still give a S2 a chance, just to see if they change it in some way. The premise/main storyline did have some potential..
Ok, now to more thoughts on Kinnaman, and am sorry for defending him, but us Swedes don't have that many big names in Hollywood.. or any kind of names...
I am a little (read: very) disappointed in my countryman Joel Kinnaman lately, cause after I saw him in "The Killing", I actually started to have a lot of respect for him, since I think he did a very fine acting job indeed, in that role!
In his role in The Killing I thought he had a very good range of emotions; he could be cool, annoyed, a badass, funny.... and do a lot of subtle work, in how he cared about his cop partner, and his nephew. The range really showed, when he also portrayed how he struggled with his drug addiction and his way, waaay "darker side". Anyone who hasn't seen that show, IMO, hasn't seen his "true" quality, as an actor. And I think it is a damn shame that he hasn't been able to find that talent within himself, again. But perhaps he might still..
I will still tune in for AC season 2 in hopes of the show developing to something more.. Did I mention I am a hopeless optimistic...
I hope Netflix renews it.
The episode dominated by the Envoy flashback was perhaps the worst.
I thought the ending was rushed, and somewhat nonsensical. We were treated to a cliched "big bad explains everything" segment, but that final fight sequence was great. Very tense. Overall the action in the series was well done.
To continue with the problems with the ending, I just don't buy it. There is no way that it would play out like it did for those Meths.
Poe was perhaps my favorite character.
Also, I gave an audible groan at "Survive. That's an order."
Otherwise, I thought the show was a lot of fun, and mostly pretty good.
I'm still going to watch S2, the worldbuilding was amazing imo and of course the visuals, but man I just pray to the Meths Ortega won't come back.
Also any society that has miraculous clone stack swapping must be able to develop some sort of verification system for what stack is actually in what sleeve so that shenanigans do not occur.....
I finally got around to watching this show and overall I enjoyed it. I don't think I had as much hatred of characters as others mentioned in this thread. Poe is definitely up there as a favorite. I think my biggest issue with the show is the whole stack/sleeve thing and that literally anyone could be anyone at any time. So it's more like how do you truly ever know. Plus, the bad guy in the end (keeping this as a non-spoiler thread) seem to have a little too much power and such and the bad guy's motive just seemed a little off to me (plus, what they claimed to have done to allow the good guy to continue on, well, how we do know that wasn't just a lie). But like i said, overall, I enjoyed the show. A tad confusing at times which I had to go read up about to make sure i was understanding events but I'd continue to watch if there is a season 2.