806 - The Iron Throne



  • Hatorian said:
    Hatorian said:
    I would be extremely interested in Daenerys as a Shakespearean tragic hero, which is what I thought she would probably be; the references are there for her (King Lear, Othello, Macbeth, probably others). But the circumstances and characters that are crucial to that downfall were either eliminated or drastically changed, so her heel turn in two episodes was done for subverting expectations and shock value. The motivations were confusing -- and I'm always up for multiple motivations, human beings are complex like that -- but the text both implies that this massacre was a premeditated act of inspiring fear, or an act of vengeance, or a sudden snap, or she is just crazy -- it's those darn Targaryen genes. Then Benioff & Weiss just can't help themselves, they have to use hardcore Hitler imagery and Tyrion's speech to Jon was eerily referencing "First they came for...", and that it is just plain offensive to compare slave masters to the marginalized groups that Hitler targeted.

    I think Daenerys burning Kings Landing will happen differently in the books that will probably never be published, and I sincerely doubt that it will happen in the penultimate chapter where Daenerys suddenly ceases to be a POV character, and we only see her though other characters' eyes, which is what happened on the show. The point of the characters' stories is "the human heart in conflict with itself," but once you make Daenerys into Hitler, which is the easiest and laziest thing to do, you've also done a major disservice to one of the main protagonists of the story and the story itself. 
    Sorry but it seems like your just coming up with new ways to be offended.

    Your first comment was you were offended about the anti-feminism in the show and then multiple people made good points (some which you liked) and I think the consensus is the show did a shit job of writing Dany but didn’t have any ill intentions towards women. 

    Now you are offended about how the show used similarity to Hitler/Nazism and arguing that it’s shitty they did this. But no mention of this before. Only after people made good arguments the show wasn’t offensive towards women. I think you are just finding ways to be offended at this point. All I saw and read was that Emilia was to replicate Hitler’s style of speech. But no one ever mentioned or said that Dany was Hitler and compared her previous actions to what he did. No one said her burning Slave Masters was equivalent to The Night of Long Knives. 

     I think you’re connecting dots that are not there for the sake of being offended by the show when really the last season was definitely shitty to some but in no way offensive. 

    So you seriously did not see the Nuremberg reference in the entire speech/visuals. Really?
    I didn’t say that. Emilia/Dany’s speech was definitely Hitleresque. But I don’t see any intention by the writers to compare slave owners or any other Westerosy to Jews/Gypsies or “subhumans” that would be taken as offensive or demeaning to people who actually suffered from Hitler’s evil methods. 
    Ok. I understand. Thanks. 
  • pavlovsbellpavlovsbell Brooklyn, NY
    No problem, @Hatorian; thank you for apologizing. We get passionate about the things we love -- that part is a good thing.

  • Doctor_NickDoctor_Nick Terminus
    I wonder what they could have done had they cut half an hour out of the various battles this season and used the money saved to have another episode's worth of connective tissue material better linking everything together.
  • CretanBullCretanBull Toronto
    edited June 9
    The best thing about the show being over (besides not having to watch another dreadful episode) is never having hear the phrase "subvert your expectations" ever again - especially when half the time it was misused.

    (Edit for clarity: that was a random though and not a shot at you @iMatty94 - I haven't listed to that podcast yet, but I will!)
  • Teresa from ConcordTeresa from Concord Concord, California
    It’s so frustrating that we still need to “guess what s/he was thinking” and listen to too many  “IMO this is what happened.” Guess it’s too soon. 
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