Woman's World Cup 2019

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  • HatorianHatorian Dagobah
    Hatorian said:


    For those of you who think it's okay because it's their dream, what about the Thai dream? I'm not clear on whether they're all pros or whether like the Andorran men's team they are part timers, teachers etc?  Humility doesn't mean dropping down to 10% from 110%.  Perspective is important.


    Not sure what point you’re trying to make here. So the US backups shouldn’t play hard because they may hurt the feelings of the Thai team? 
    No. I'm saying their dreams are just as valid. They are no less human, and saying "git gud" is like saying because they aren't as skilled that it's okay to humiliate them, because you can.
    The celebrations were definitely too much but I do t think any of the players on the US team were trying to humiliate the Thai team. I think they just played their best and they were by far the better team. 
  • HatorianHatorian Dagobah

    Looks like the US put mostly reserves today against Chile. Looks like that whole "we gotta score as many goals as possible in case of a tie breaker" wasn't really a sincere argument.
    It’s still a valid argument. But they know they locked up the tiebreaker so they took the foot off the pedal. Just like when teams clinch playoff spots. After they know they are in they rest the starters. But they don’t do that until they have secured it. 
    cdrive
  • cdrivecdrive Houston, TX
    Hatorian said:

    Looks like the US put mostly reserves today against Chile. Looks like that whole "we gotta score as many goals as possible in case of a tie breaker" wasn't really a sincere argument.
    It’s still a valid argument. But they know they locked up the tiebreaker so they took the foot off the pedal. Just like when teams clinch playoff spots. After they know they are in they rest the starters. But they don’t do that until they have secured it. 
    Yup.


    Hatorian
  • Hatorian said:


    For those of you who think it's okay because it's their dream, what about the Thai dream? I'm not clear on whether they're all pros or whether like the Andorran men's team they are part timers, teachers etc?  Humility doesn't mean dropping down to 10% from 110%.  Perspective is important.


    Not sure what point you’re trying to make here. So the US backups shouldn’t play hard because they may hurt the feelings of the Thai team? 
    It wasn't the back ups pouring it on and celebrating. Rapinoe, Lloyd and Morgan are world champions with dozens of goals at the international level.


    This entire conversation is bizarre to me. The arguments for why they ran up the score and celebrated wildly are bizarre. They did it because they could and wanted to. Not because they were new to the world cup, or worried that they needed a tie breaker in case Sweden scored 12.
  • cdrivecdrive Houston, TX
    edited June 17

    But that’s not true. There were in fact players in that 13-0 that scored a goal where it was their first goal in their first World Cup. Wasn’t just those 3 veterans on the field.  Case in point the Pugh goal making it 11-0. Celebrating the 11th goal how obnoxious right? Well, no. Pugh is 21. It’s her first World Cup goal in her first World Cup and it tied the record.  Back to the vets, even Morgan celebrating her 5th goal...that broke a record. So they celebrated. To me it’s “so what.” And then they rested. Ooooooh. To me it’s “so what”.  Like the Great Greg Pappovich....load management. 

    The girls are all right with me. <insert USA chant>




    tom_gHatorian
  • cdrive said:

    But that’s not true. There were in fact players in that 13-0 that scored a goal where it was their first goal in their first World Cup. Wasn’t just those 3 veterans on the field.  Case in point the Pugh goal making it 11-0. Celebrating the 11th goal how obnoxious right? Well, no. Pugh is 21. It’s her first World Cup goal in her first World Cup and it tied the record.  Back to the vets, even Morgan celebrating her 5th goal...that broke a record. So they celebrated. To me it’s “so what.” And then they rested. Ooooooh. To me it’s “so what”.  Like the Great Greg Pappovich....load management. 

    The girls are all right with me. <insert USA chant>




    And Rapinoe, and Lloyd... this is really ridiculous. Wanna be the heel at least have the guts to be the heel.
  • cdrivecdrive Houston, TX
    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
  • michielterlouwmichielterlouw Helsinki
    edited June 18
    Half the number of matches has now been played during this tournament, and people are still debating last week's match between the US and Thailand. Is that really the only think we are going to talk about here?

    I was hoping to find a lively discussion here about all the teams and the matches that are being played.

    For example:
    1. Which teams have impressed you so far? Who do you think could make it to the final?
      The US women have shown why they are the clear favorites for the title.
      France seems strong, and they have the home advantage. But if they top their group, they will have to face the US before the final.
      Germany, England, The Netherland.... they have all started a bit lack-lustre but are winning their matches.
      I haven't seen Japan play, but I've understood it's a pretty good team.


    2. The penalty that was given to France in their match against Norway: good call from the ref?
      Not a penalty in my opinion. Yes, the Norwegian player kicked the French player, but it was clearly an accident and a penalty seemed way to harsh imo.

    3. Who is the best player of the tournament?
      Vivianne Miedema (Dutch center forward). The Canadian goalie will know what I mean after Thursday :-)
    Elisa
  • amyja89amyja89 Oxford, England
    I'm underwhelmed by my England team so far, but hopefully they are playing their way into the tournament like the Italian men used to do so often for a deep run. Looking forward to the Japan game tomorrow.
  • amyja89amyja89 Oxford, England
    Gutted for Scotland. This penalty rule is absolute fucking bullshit. You might as well ban players from taking a run up too. There is a difference between coming up on the six yard line and taking one fucking step for momentum.
    CretanBull
  • amyja89 said:
    Gutted for Scotland. This penalty rule is absolute fucking bullshit. You might as well ban players from taking a run up too. There is a difference between coming up on the six yard line and taking one fucking step for momentum.
    It's particularly stupid in women's soccer where the keepers tend not to be as tall and they need that step to push off from to reach the corners.
  • amyja89 said:
    Gutted for Scotland. This penalty rule is absolute fucking bullshit. You might as well ban players from taking a run up too. There is a difference between coming up on the six yard line and taking one fucking step for momentum.
    You'd recommend what?

    No line?
    A new line?
    Sometimes it's called - others it isn't?

    Every step forward cuts down the angle.  Keepers are told before each PK.  There are rules, in this sport they are more than rules, they are LAWS.  Really, what to do - not call it.  It was only 2 feet, is that allowed?  How about 3?
  • tom_g said:
    amyja89 said:
    Gutted for Scotland. This penalty rule is absolute fucking bullshit. You might as well ban players from taking a run up too. There is a difference between coming up on the six yard line and taking one fucking step for momentum.
    You'd recommend what?

    No line?
    A new line?
    Sometimes it's called - others it isn't?

    Every step forward cuts down the angle.  Keepers are told before each PK.  There are rules, in this sport they are more than rules, they are LAWS.  Really, what to do - not call it.  It was only 2 feet, is that allowed?  How about 3?
    I get your point and don't have a direct answer for it, but something to consider...the average female keeper is 5'8 and the average male keeper is 6'3.  Male keepers struggle to get to the corners, if the average female keeper is 7 inches shorter very, very few will ever be able to get there.  If there's zero tolerance when it comes to moving before the strike, a penalty kick might as well just be a free goal.
  • The retake of the PK in question crossed the goal line about 6 inches from where the keeper started.

    I like that female soccer players play with the same rules.  Should there be different pitch sizes?  Should throw-in be different to accommodate smaller hands?
    CretanBull
  • tom_g said:
    The retake of the PK in question crossed the goal line about 6 inches from where the keeper started.

    I like that female soccer players play with the same rules.  Should there be different pitch sizes?  Should throw-in be different to accommodate smaller hands?
    No, I don't want to see different rules for women...but the rules (for everyone) are interpreted.  The baseball rule book tells us exactly what the strike-zone is, but anyone who watches baseball knows that each ump has their own strike-zone.  There's a tacit admission that the rules of any sport that requires a judge, ref, ump etc have a degree of subjectivity to them...I'm just saying that this is an area where it could be possible to have a less strict interpretation of the rules for the betterment of the game.  How do we do this fairly and consistently, especially on a play that's as (relatively) rare as a PK? I don't know...but trickier problems have been solved.  
  • tom_gtom_g WV
    edited June 20
    I was a FIFA and US High School official for 10ish years.  The issue discussed here is not up for interpretation, it is as clear as a ball being in or out of play.  It is or it isn't.  If it is not seen, it might not be called, but, it should have been - this is where real controversy occurs.  What if the keeper in Game 1 makes the save after leaving the goal line early, and gets away with it - then the keeper in Game 2 makes the save after leaving the goal line early, and a re-kick is called.  The real travesty is to the team in Game 1 that did not get the re-kick.  They did nothing wrong. 

    Red v Yellow - interpretation - what constitutes excessive?
    Advantage - Interpretation - does advantage really exist?
    Handling - interpretation - did the ball play the hand or did the hand play the ball?
    Off-sides - perception - was the attacking player leaning at exactly the point the ball was played forward??

    Encroachment - NO INTERPRETATION - call the fricken re-kick if required.
  • Have been a fan of a few of the Canadian players during their college years (they played here in my home town).  Glad they are moving on!!
    CretanBull
  • tom_g said:
    I was a FIFA and US High School official for 10ish years.  The issue discussed here is not up for interpretation, it is as clear as a ball being in or out of play.  It is or it isn't.  If it is not seen, it might not be called, but, it should have been - this is where real controversy occurs.  What if the keeper in Game 1 makes the save after leaving the goal line early, and gets away with it - then the keeper in Game 2 makes the save after leaving the goal line early, and a re-kick is called.  The real travesty is to the team in Game 1 that did not get the re-kick.  They did nothing wrong. 

    Red v Yellow - interpretation - what constitutes excessive?
    Advantage - Interpretation - does advantage really exist?
    Handling - interpretation - did the ball play the hand or did the hand play the ball?
    Off-sides - perception - was the attacking player leaning at exactly the point the ball was played forward??

    Encroachment - NO INTERPRETATION - call the fricken re-kick if required.
    We're arguing different things here.  I wasn't advocating to allow for the keeper to be able jump forward off their line - my initial reply (and what I've been talking about all along!) was about not calling it encroachment when a player takes a step (even if it's forward) for the purpose of planting their foot to push-off from when leaping to the corner.  That's what I've been referring to when mentioning allowing for an interpretation.  I'm saying, let's not treat a keeper who takes a step forward to plant their foot the same way we treat a keeper who leaps forward to cut down the shooting angle.

  • amyja89amyja89 Oxford, England
    tom_g said:
    amyja89 said:
    Gutted for Scotland. This penalty rule is absolute fucking bullshit. You might as well ban players from taking a run up too. There is a difference between coming up on the six yard line and taking one fucking step for momentum.
    You'd recommend what?

    No line?
    A new line?
    Sometimes it's called - others it isn't?

    Every step forward cuts down the angle.  Keepers are told before each PK.  There are rules, in this sport they are more than rules, they are LAWS.  Really, what to do - not call it.  It was only 2 feet, is that allowed?  How about 3?
    There is a lino right there on the touch line with the keeper when pens are taken. In the 25 plus years I've been watching football it's obvious to see when a keeper has overstepped and done too much on the line. In the past there have been no arguments with linos flagging this and having the ref order the pen again. This is for crazy infringement though, where everyone in the ground can see they they've run right out. I don't know why this particular rule has to change. It's like taking a throw in, at least one out of every five or six throws in a game is a foul throw, I always call them watching at a ground or on the TV, but VAR has chosen that this isn't worth policing? What if a foul throw leads to a cross which leads to a goal? VAR is taking a lot of the human decision making and common sense out of football and it's becoming tedious and robotic.
  • Question about the rules, a cammeronian player kicked a ball to their GK and the GK picked up the ball which is I didn’t know is against the rules. When can a GK pick up a ball and when can’t they?
  • amyja89amyja89 Oxford, England
    edited June 23
    adobo1148 said:
    Question about the rules, a cammeronian player kicked a ball to their GK and the GK picked up the ball which is I didn’t know is against the rules. When can a GK pick up a ball and when can’t they?
    A keeper can pick up a header from a teammate, as well as any kind of shot or header from an opponent. They can’t touch a ball that has been deemed deliberately passed back to them by a teammate, they can only kick or head it away. The punishment is an indirect free kick from where ever the keeper touches the ball.
    Elisa
  • ^ and just to add to that, the keeper can only handle the ball in the 18 yard box, once they leave that area they're just like every other player.
    Elisa
  • amyja89 said:
    adobo1148 said:
    Question about the rules, a cammeronian player kicked a ball to their GK and the GK picked up the ball which is I didn’t know is against the rules. When can a GK pick up a ball and when can’t they?
    A keeper can pick up a header from a teammate, as well as any kind of shot or header from an opponent. They can’t touch a ball that has been deemed deliberately passed back to them by a teammate, they can only kick or head it away. The punishment is an indirect free kick from where ever the keeper touches the ball.

    One of the best rule changes ever imo. I still remember when goalies were allowed to pick up a ball that was passed back to them by their team mate, and that enabled a team to slow down the game almost to a complete stand-still.

    CapeGabeadobo1148
  • One further note on a back-pass to the keeper - the restart is an indirect free kick.  It must be touched twice - it cannot directly enter the goal.
  • amyja89amyja89 Oxford, England
    Yikes what a game. I’m glad that’s over.
    Elisa
  • Is it my imagination or do women not work the refs as much as the men? Also i dont see as much diving. 
    Aww_PHuuCk
  • cdrivecdrive Houston, TX
    I always root for Brasil, my fam. I don’t care how many people hate Neymar. Go Brasil! 
    Aww_PHuuCkElisa
  • amyja89 said:
    adobo1148 said:
    Question about the rules, a cammeronian player kicked a ball to their GK and the GK picked up the ball which is I didn’t know is against the rules. When can a GK pick up a ball and when can’t they?
    A keeper can pick up a header from a teammate, as well as any kind of shot or header from an opponent. They can’t touch a ball that has been deemed deliberately passed back to them by a teammate, they can only kick or head it away. The punishment is an indirect free kick from where ever the keeper touches the ball.

    One of the best rule changes ever imo. I still remember when goalies were allowed to pick up a ball that was passed back to them by their team mate, and that enabled a team to slow down the game almost to a complete stand-still.

    I’d liken that to bball before the shot clock. It must have been unbearable watching a team just play keep away without shooting the ball and end up having games where neither team gets out of the 30s
  • adobo1148 said:
    Is it my imagination or do women not work the refs as much as the men? Also i dont see as much diving. 
    This is one of the things that people hate about the American team, they aren't as bad now that Abby Wambach is gone (she was the worst ever) but it still annoys people that the best team relentlessly badgers the ref.
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