301 - The Book of Kevin

24

Comments

  • MichelleMichelle California
    edited April 2017
    @joepinetree Thank you for that. I feel like the average viewer may not have made that connection though; it's a very specific piece of religious history to have knowledge on. I mean, I consider myself fairly well educated, and to me it struck more than a slight resemblance to the creation and mannerisms of the present day Guilty Remnants. No, the GR's aren't trying to get to heaven, but...dressed in all white, sleeping on the floor, shunned by a society who doesn't follow their line of thinking? Am I out here on this limb all alone?
  • I can't get over how good this show is. This episode was funny, it was sad, it was shocking, it was everything. So many questions, which I have no doubt will be answered, at least most of them. At the end I knew it was Nora as soon as I saw she was riding the bicycle standing up, just like Nora in Jarden. This is btw a callback to Perrotta's book, where she used to go on long bike rides all the time.

    @Michelle I had never heard of the millerites before, but I didn't think GR straight away when I saw those people. I thought they were waiting for the Rapture or some other event like that (the date calculations reminded me of Jim & A.Ron's JW podcast when they said how things were predicted and then given new dates over and over again when said thing didn't happen as it was supposed to). But there's clearly a thematic connection to the GR anyway as it cut straight to them through the sleeping-on-floor scene.

    @aberry89 I think the explanation to John's massive character shift is very simple: it's Laurie. Remember how she cooked up the Holy Tommy story as well, just so they could help people? That's exactly what she's doing now with John. They want to give closure to those who so desperately seek it. They want to help. It's not a scam. That's why they're shredding the money.
    Michellepavlovsbell
  • Oh, this show has been away for far too long. I don't think I'd fully processed the fact that it was back until that piano music started playing. And what an episode! I was worried that I may have spoiled too much of the season by watching trailers and reading pre-release reviews, but there was still so much here that was completely unexpected and amazing. No idea where it's all going, but my pre-season worries are completely gone. Holy shit, everyone - The Leftovers is back.
  • JohnnyCharismaJohnnyCharisma Australia
    edited April 2017
    Can't wait to get into the season: my expectations are sky high.

    Question- has anyone watched the "in the weeks ahead" extended promo? If so- how spoilery is it? Apparently for Season 2 it had some big spoilers in it, so I am reluctant to watch it this time around (as much as I'm tempted to)
  • I need to watch it again, I'm sure I missed a lot but I love how it just drops stuff on you with no explanation:  Erika and the baby's absence, Nora's cast, John's complete ideological turnabout, Kevin's auto-asphyxiation ritual, the apparent sudden wiping from the board of the GR, etc.  Sarah also although I guess that's a more traditional kind of "mystery"--it gets its own scene and is clearly intended to draw a big WTF.  The show gives the audience the benefit of the doubt that they are paying attention, so in turn I give it the benefit of the doubt that these things are either unknowable (like the central mystery of the Departure itself) or that everything will pay off.  It just feels so much like this is the promise of LOST carried out the way it should have been originally:  Concentrate on the characters, the mysteries are mostly incidental and don't build up too much what you can't resolve.  I resolve final judgement until the series finale since I guess they could still fuck it up (LOST's first couple of seasons were amazing before it became apparent it wasn't going to pay off), but I have...  faith, lol, that they won't.
    Melia004
  • They clearly have some major problems under the surface, but it's great to see most of them doing well. Kevin, Chief of Police for a never ending burning man. Tommy!!! Tommy finally in a good spot without all the angst.
    So cathartic.... before it's all ripped away.
    Nora is broken again and in search of children.
    Kevin is attempting suicide, daily?
    Matt is using his family as a prop to sell Jarden as Miracle, ewww. Also using John's pain and his belief in Kevin's resurrection as false hope for his daughter, double ewww.
    Jill is filled with two much pain to be around the family.
    Elisa
  • LucasLucas Milwaukee
    So Jesus had 4 gospel writers, and it appears at the moment we only have seen three.  I wonder who the fourth writer is going to be?

    Also, I love that they "gospel" writers are basically telling Kevin what we as an audience are saying. "Hey man, its not normal to come back from the dead... twice.  Seems like a lot of coincidences."  Love it, great opener.
    Elisa
  • GeorgeGeorge Astoria, New York
    I too hated John scamming people reading palms. Seemed like a real jump from him in season 2 to now. But a lot could have happened in the those three years.

    I took the ending as being a flash forward, and the question being posed almost as someone who is trying to spread the word of Jesus would have asked. But I could be projecting, because I didn't even know who that was initially lol.
  • Ah. An awesome episode of tv on my birthday :) April 17th
    FernNYC17voodooratMichelleMelonuskA_Ron_HubbardDummypavlovsbellJohnnyCharisma
  • GeorgeGeorge Astoria, New York
    Happy birthday, dude @iMatty94
    iMatty94
  • SOOMOOSOOMOO Nottingham
    Anybody else feel like they just held there breath for the whole hour. Awesome start for the best ever series contender.
  • ksa1001ksa1001 Plano, TX
    Waiting until Easter Sunday...good move Leftovers.

    This show is amazing, and somehow makes me more anxious when things are going well for everyone.

    I keep waiting for the other shoe to drop, and then we get the suffocation scene.

    Holy shit.

    I didn't see a cut or edit in there...that's some scary shit!
    Andrew Stadler
  • edited April 2017
    A thought that just popped into my head - when Kevin is suffocating himself it looks like this is something he routinely does, he's not nervous about it or anything... does he go to the hotel every time? Is he in contact with someone? Meg, Evie, the Australian dude, his dad through the tv? I mean, there's gotta be a reason he's doing it and trying to off himself for good is not it.
    darwinfeeshyLucasEine Frau
  • FernNYC17FernNYC17 New York, NY
    Reni said:

    A thought that just popped into my head - when Kevin is suffocating himself it looks like this is something he routinely does, he's not nervous about it or anything... does he go to the hotel every time? Is he in contact with someone? Meg, Evie, the Australian dude, his dad through the tv? I mean, there's gotta be a reason he's doing it and trying to off himself for good is not it.

    i was on the other side of the coin. when i first saw that scene first thing that came to mind is a test. i can see Kevin testing to make sure he can die by doing this routine every day or every other day and when he feels like he about to die he rips the bag open. in his head he like see i was about to die so everyone else is crazy. Time to start my day.
    Eine Frau
  • George said:

    I too hated John scamming people reading palms. Seemed like a real jump from him in season 2 to now. But a lot could have happened in the those three years.


    I took the ending as being a flash forward, and the question being posed almost as someone who is trying to spread the word of Jesus would have asked. But I could be projecting, because I didn't even know who that was initially lol.
    The idea is not so much that he is scamming them (see him destroy the money) but that, at least in his mind, he is giving people closure that they would not otherwise have. It's like when Laurie had Tommy act like Wayne.
    voodooratA_Ron_HubbardMichellephoenyx1023pavlovsbelldarwinfeeshyLucasEine FrauGeorge
  • All the ChickensAll the Chickens Birmingham, AL
    edited April 2017
    --When my wife and I re-watched the S2 finale before flipping on the S3 premiere, I remember remarking to her about how there was no way in hell these people would be able to turn this town into a hellish Burning Man event without the feds flying in the very next day to put a stop to that shit. I did NOT, however, expect them to blast a crater into the park Welcome Center with a damned guided missile.

    --I laughed out loud at the Canine World Domination scenes.

    --What happened to to the baby and Erika? Did more than just the GR die in the big attack from the S2 finale?

    --The old woman Nora aka "Sarah" in Australia really threw me for a loop. Mostly because it seems to indicate that Nora lives through whatever is to come in the events from this season (the countdown to the 7 year anniversary anyhow), especially since we know they are heading to Australia in the upcoming episodes. I'm sure there are plenty of theories of how that scene was somehow happening in 'real time' alongside the other scenes from the episode(I can think of a few myself), but until I see it I'm assuming they are showing us that Nora 2.0 is still alive well after whatever events unfold in the next few weeks. 
    Elisapavlovsbell
  • The idea is not so much that he is scamming them (see him destroy the money) but that, at least in his mind, he is giving people closure that they would not otherwise have. It's like when Laurie had Tommy act like Wayne.

    yeah, it's clear he's trying to help them (albeit by deceiving them) rather than trying to take advantage of them for his own benefit (he shreds the money).  so i guess it's not exactly the same thing he was so opposed to before--presumably the charlatans he was so upset by years before were doing it for self-serving reasons, but it does still feel weird.
    pavlovsbell
  • edited April 2017
    Excellent opener!

    I had a feeling that Kevin was going to become some sort of new uplifting figure even before the trailers for this season, and while it seems like that's the thrust, the Kevin Kult's (for lack of a better term) genesis is so much stranger and riveting than I imagined.  I figured Kevin would demonstrate some sort of heroic will to live that would be a direct opposition to the GR, and in a grand display, made their infection of hopelessness completely irrelevent, thus destroying the GR's hold.  However, and maybe I'm wrong, but it feels the GR is little more than a memory.  This show could zag on me hard, though, so who knows, they are probably planning something wicked in silence.

    A few things did bug/concern me however:

    * Meg, along with Evie, being completely destroyed right off the bat was awesome, but also bummed me out a bit.  Meg was such a great character last season that I imagined great new things with her and her brand of GR.  I also felt there was some meat left on the Evie character bones too.  Oh well, maybe the GR will use them as martyrs to a much larger degree, like the teens at the pond seem to.  

    * The ending scene with old Nora.  This concerns me in the sense that the worse parts of LOST for me were the flash-forwards.  I hope this is VERY sparingly used.  Maybe Lindelof and co. will make me eat my hat, but I fear that particular instinct of Lindelof's storytelling brand.

    * While I mentioned this with Meg, the shedding of characters in quick fashion seemed to almost be a theme this episode.  Mary, Jill, and perhaps even little Lily.  There seemed to be some finality in their scenes.  I hope I'm wrong about Jill, but the car ride into the distance definitely seemed to be a series exit.  I want to see how she reacts to her dad becoming Jesus damnit!  And Mary!  If that's an exit for her, poor Janel Moloney.  She finally gets to play something beyond a vegetable and poof, off the show. :P

    Anyways, all my concerns, which quite honestly, are fairly mild in the grand scheme of things and could end up being for not in the long run.  Outside those current minor quibbles, however, I'm fully and completely in on this season.  Can't wait for the podcast and next week!
    GredalBeeElisapavlovsbell
  • George said:

    Happy birthday, dude @iMatty94

    Thank you

    George
  • After re-watching parts of this episode, there was a strong hint that it was Nora with her riding the bike mirroring earlier in the episode when she was leaving the house. And I laughed at the troll of Lindelof with Dean & the Canine DNA, similar to Patti from last season with Cairo. I love this show so much!


  • CoryCory New Scotland
    Those students/protesters/whatever; was it a smart thing to fake poison the lake?  Say Kevin never jumps in and everyone thinks it really was poisoned, but as the days/weeks/months pass life in the lake continues to flourish.  Suddenly it's proof that the lake is a blessed miracle place!

    The opposite result they wanted.
    darwinfeeshy
  • George said:


    I took the ending as being a flash forward, and the question being posed almost as someone who is trying to spread the word of Jesus would have asked. But I could be projecting, because I didn't even know who that was initially lol.

    We just needed Jack to be standing in the background screaming "We have to go back!"
    ElisaGeorge
  • A_Ron_HubbardA_Ron_Hubbard Cincinnati, OH
    Reni said:

    @Michelle I had never heard of the millerites before, but I didn't think GR straight away when I saw those people. I thought they were waiting for the Rapture or some other event like that (the date calculations reminded me of Jim & A.Ron's JW podcast when they said how things were predicted and then given new dates over and over again when said thing didn't happen as it was supposed to). But there's clearly a thematic connection to the GR anyway as it cut straight to them through the sleeping-on-floor scene.

    Ha!  Not only that, but the Millerites heavily influenced the International Bible Students, who became known as Jehovah's Witnesses in the 1930's.  I don't think it's intended to mean that Millerites are the antecedents of the GR, but to show how human history is pretty repleat with these kinds of sectarian adventures.  What happened with Miracle at the end of last season was a lot like what happened in Munster centuries ago, and met similar results.
    MichelleElisapavlovsbellLucasEine Frauksa1001
  • A_Ron_HubbardA_Ron_Hubbard Cincinnati, OH
    edited April 2017

    --The old woman Nora aka "Sarah" in Australia really threw me for a loop. Mostly because it seems to indicate that Nora lives through whatever is to come in the events from this season (the countdown to the 7 year anniversary anyhow), especially since we know they are heading to Australia in the upcoming episodes. I'm sure there are plenty of theories of how that scene was somehow happening in 'real time' alongside the other scenes from the episode(I can think of a few myself), but until I see it I'm assuming they are showing us that Nora 2.0 is still alive well after whatever events unfold in the next few weeks. 
    Another interesting potential Biblical parallel.  Abraham's wife was renamed to Sarah after she bore him a child.  Abraham later sacrificed this child, Isaac, at the behest of the Lord, before being stopped by an angel at the last second.  It you see this through the crazy lens of the Leftovers there are all kinds of possibilities on why Nora would be in hiding and deny Kevin.  Although 13 days isn't long enough to conceive and bear a child.  

    Or is it?  Maybe if you buried a poisoned pregnant lady with a bird in a shoe box overnight... nah, I got nothing.
    KingKobraLucasAll the Chickens
  • calebthrowercalebthrower South Carolina
    I have a feeling Bald Move will reach record podcast length with this final season of The Leftover. So much stuff to unpack.The scene by scene recap could be a major podcast on their own.
    MichelleToadieMelonusk
  • There really needs to be an episode explaining Erica's absence and John's 360 view change on life. I really hope Regina King didn't want to come back and they had to do a plan B script. We'll see...
  • Reni said:

    @Michelle I had never heard of the millerites before, but I didn't think GR straight away when I saw those people. I thought they were waiting for the Rapture or some other event like that (the date calculations reminded me of Jim & A.Ron's JW podcast when they said how things were predicted and then given new dates over and over again when said thing didn't happen as it was supposed to). But there's clearly a thematic connection to the GR anyway as it cut straight to them through the sleeping-on-floor scene.

    Ha!  Not only that, but the Millerites heavily influenced the International Bible Students, who became known as Jehovah's Witnesses in the 1930's.  I don't think it's intended to mean that Millerites are the antecedents of the GR, but to show how human history is pretty repleat with these kinds of sectarian adventures.  What happened with Miracle at the end of last season was a lot like what happened in Munster centuries ago, and met similar results.
    I had no idea that you guys did a podcast on your JW experience and now I have 2+ hours of thoughtful entertainment while I work.  Thanks!  And I take it you've listened to Dan Carlin's podcast on the Munster incident?  That was one of the first thoughts I had with the GR invading Miracle.  

    Meg was the Jan van Leiden of Jarden, using Evie as her inside influence to bust into Miracle.  The difference being (and one of my predictions before this episode literally blew it up with a drone) that Meg never got to go full Munster, take over the town, and basically brutalize it until they were taken back over.  In the long term, I wonder what effect Meg and her GR really had on the town of Jarden?  Sure it's more inclusive now, and it's not as neat and tidy, but the effect of Jarden and the Miracle of the 14th seems to be intact or perhaps even stronger.  It seems Meg failed in amazing fashion outside of some property damage.  Jarden still seems to be special and a place that all come to bask in its "glory".  Is the GR done with Jarden?  With only 7 episodes, I don't know how they get all these threads in place, but from critical buzz, it seems like they do.  
  • @JTKIII I'm pretty sure it's next episode.

    You didn't hear it from me ;)
    JTKIII
  • edited April 2017
    JTKIII said:

    There really needs to be an episode explaining Erica's absence and John's 360 view change on life. I really hope Regina King didn't want to come back and they had to do a plan B script. We'll see...

    Interesting that people seemed to be confused with John's change of viewpoint.

    He literally shot a dude, mostly likely to death, who came back at the same time his daughter came "back to life" who then, the next morning, was blown to absolute hell.

    Stronger men have turned to outright cults (let alone the simple belief in the supernatural) for much less.  Not to mention, that's kind of a large part of the Leftovers themes.  In this world, John's turn is beyond natural. 
    CoryElisaphoenyx1023KingKobraMelonuskpavlovsbellksa1001
  • Few questions I have:

    - What was it that Meg/Evie had planned that Evie wanted to start right away but Meg was waiting?  Is it still out there in motion?

    - Did Evie run outside because she didn't want to die/had a change of heart last minute?

    - What happened to the real palm print guy?  

    - Why does everyone have beards???

    - The Millerite lady - did she go into the church to die? Why were they all lying like that?

    - What if the water was poisoned but it was cleared when he dove in - much like the water disappeared when he jumped in with a cement block tied to him.  That could be why they were all silent.

    - Colors.  Are colors being a part of a theme here?  GR was typically gone but now the Christians are wearing white while the GR activists are wearing red and yelling.

    So many questions.  So many ways this can go.  I'm fucking stoked this is back.  I seriously need to rewatch this 3 more times.
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