Succession Pod
I am not here to moan about the guys hating succession because ultimately I don't need everyone else to like a show I think his special to enjoy it! And quite frankly the show gets enough love. Still got a lot of love for the guys.
However, I do think some of the points they raise are worth discussing as a community!
1. They seem to repeatedly compare the characters to sitcom characters like Always Sunny/Veep/Arrested Development. Those characters are cartoonish characters who for the most part couldn't exist in the real world and those shows don't expect you to imagine them that way which is why you can switch your mind off too them.
However, with Succession these dispicable people can and crucially DO exist in the real world. So, I find the complaint that its unrealistic of the show to be able to humanise them a strange one because none of these characters do anything that we don't see happen repeatedly on a daily basis.
2. Why would I want to watch such repulsive characters and how could I empathise with them? They reference Walter White's empathy. So, because he's a bit down and out of his luck at the start we can empathise with a deranged egotistical meth dealer who murders people and covers up a childs murder? But a Billionaire born into wealth being brutally mistreated by his father is impossible to empathise with because he, what, he wasn't s schlub ever?
3. It's not funny. Wow, I don't know what to say to that but comedy is subjective! FYI, the creator and Showrunner of succession Jessie Armstrong also worked heavily on VEEP. I find both shows to have EXACTLY the same sense of humour and style as all of Jessie's work tends too.
4. Another point on empathy would be 'I can't empathise with these people because all their problems can be solved by them just not doing terrible things to each other'. Like, I dunno, the whole history of the human race, forever? I think the biggest shame of Aron not liking this show is that, as it goes on, it has great social commentary on the right wing media, media moguls (Rupert Murdoch is a huge influence on Logan and the show originally started life as a screenplay about the Murdoch family) wealth distribution, politics (the episode where they 'pick' the next president in season 3 is absolutely terrifying.) I think Aron would dig a lot of the topics as they go on
5. As a side note to the person that commissioned it I think the infamous therapy episode in season 1 would have maybe hooked Aron more than jumping to season 2.
6. I'm sure Arons point on satire is a great study but, as person from the UK.. satire didn't make people like Maragret Thatcher. Everybody very much still hates Margaret Thatcher except the people who liked her in the first place. Also, do we stop satirising? One of the greatest forms of comedy we have. I think to almost start saying this show could be dangerous to society is extremely unfair.
7. I don't think anybody watching this show see's the characters lives as envious or anybody to aspire too. Not in any way like Don draper was. We all understand they're terrible.
8. The open marriage would be more interesting as a working class family story because they're would be stakes? Or Kendall can just say bye to his dad and move. I think the lack of belief the guys have that you can't have any stakes if you're a billionaire. For me family is family regardless of wealth. What would it take? If their was a storyline that the dad sexually abused Kendall his whole childhood would you say 'that isn't interesting because he's rich so he can just get therapy?' Well, he emotionally abused him his whole childhood. To not empathise with that just because he's so rich I find confusing.
9. Also, Aron won't know, but Tom is from a completely working class background but is perhaps the most disgusting game player for power of all of them. So, it's not just the wealthy.
10. In terms of not being able to enjoy the show because of external social factors. I'd say I'm completely aligned with all of Arons beliefs politically and socially but I don't find that impacts my enjoyment at all. In fact I find my knowledge of the subject matters and repulsion actually takes the show to another level. Each to their own I guess!
However, I do think some of the points they raise are worth discussing as a community!
1. They seem to repeatedly compare the characters to sitcom characters like Always Sunny/Veep/Arrested Development. Those characters are cartoonish characters who for the most part couldn't exist in the real world and those shows don't expect you to imagine them that way which is why you can switch your mind off too them.
However, with Succession these dispicable people can and crucially DO exist in the real world. So, I find the complaint that its unrealistic of the show to be able to humanise them a strange one because none of these characters do anything that we don't see happen repeatedly on a daily basis.
2. Why would I want to watch such repulsive characters and how could I empathise with them? They reference Walter White's empathy. So, because he's a bit down and out of his luck at the start we can empathise with a deranged egotistical meth dealer who murders people and covers up a childs murder? But a Billionaire born into wealth being brutally mistreated by his father is impossible to empathise with because he, what, he wasn't s schlub ever?
3. It's not funny. Wow, I don't know what to say to that but comedy is subjective! FYI, the creator and Showrunner of succession Jessie Armstrong also worked heavily on VEEP. I find both shows to have EXACTLY the same sense of humour and style as all of Jessie's work tends too.
4. Another point on empathy would be 'I can't empathise with these people because all their problems can be solved by them just not doing terrible things to each other'. Like, I dunno, the whole history of the human race, forever? I think the biggest shame of Aron not liking this show is that, as it goes on, it has great social commentary on the right wing media, media moguls (Rupert Murdoch is a huge influence on Logan and the show originally started life as a screenplay about the Murdoch family) wealth distribution, politics (the episode where they 'pick' the next president in season 3 is absolutely terrifying.) I think Aron would dig a lot of the topics as they go on
5. As a side note to the person that commissioned it I think the infamous therapy episode in season 1 would have maybe hooked Aron more than jumping to season 2.
6. I'm sure Arons point on satire is a great study but, as person from the UK.. satire didn't make people like Maragret Thatcher. Everybody very much still hates Margaret Thatcher except the people who liked her in the first place. Also, do we stop satirising? One of the greatest forms of comedy we have. I think to almost start saying this show could be dangerous to society is extremely unfair.
7. I don't think anybody watching this show see's the characters lives as envious or anybody to aspire too. Not in any way like Don draper was. We all understand they're terrible.
8. The open marriage would be more interesting as a working class family story because they're would be stakes? Or Kendall can just say bye to his dad and move. I think the lack of belief the guys have that you can't have any stakes if you're a billionaire. For me family is family regardless of wealth. What would it take? If their was a storyline that the dad sexually abused Kendall his whole childhood would you say 'that isn't interesting because he's rich so he can just get therapy?' Well, he emotionally abused him his whole childhood. To not empathise with that just because he's so rich I find confusing.
9. Also, Aron won't know, but Tom is from a completely working class background but is perhaps the most disgusting game player for power of all of them. So, it's not just the wealthy.
10. In terms of not being able to enjoy the show because of external social factors. I'd say I'm completely aligned with all of Arons beliefs politically and socially but I don't find that impacts my enjoyment at all. In fact I find my knowledge of the subject matters and repulsion actually takes the show to another level. Each to their own I guess!
Comments
I think their comparison to reality shows is valid, in that the viewer can enjoy awful people getting their comeuppance.
The show presents different degrees of awfulness, with Logan typically being the absolute worst. Generally it's clear whom to root for in any given situation. They didn't mention Sopranos, but I think that would be another interesting comparison. (I could never get into Sopranos for a lot of the reasons they mentioned on the Succession pod.)